What they're saying: McNabb debate; Vick's future
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What they're saying: McNabb debate; Vick's future
Sheil Kapadia, Philly.com
I had the opportunity to spend Wednesday morning with the fine folks at Freire Charter School as part of their Career Day.
My goal when speaking to each of the four groups was to avoid having more than three students fall asleep on me. So I started with an informal poll:
Raise your hand if you want Donovan McNabb gone.
Raise your hand if you want the Eagles to keep McNabb.
The results: 30 of 39 students want him gone (77 percent).
Among the reasons they provided: He's "corny." He makes bad decisions. He's always injured. He can't win the big games. He's washed up. He's been here for too long.
The point of this? Everyone has an opinion about McNabb and whether he should be the Eagles' starting quarterback next season.
Here's a roundup of links on that topic, and some others:
Mike Lombardi of the National Football Post advises fans not to blame McNabb:
The fans will blame McNabb because that’s the easiest thing to do, but the core issue, especially against the Cowboys, is that their defensive line can’t match up to the Cowboys. Unless Trent Cole can make a play coming off the edge, the Eagles lose every matchup in the front seven. Mike Patterson, the Eagles defensive tackle, is a nice player, a good player, but he’s not a pass rusher, and his lack of size is a problem when facing Leonard Davis, the Cowboys’ massive right guard. No other player can consistently dominate for the Birds, while the Cowboys have several players who dominate against the Eagles offensive line. The reason for the loss to the ‘Boys lies in both lines, not McNabb. The Cowboys can dominate the line of scrimmage, and their ability to pressure McNabb takes the Eagles offense out of the game. The Eagles are NOT a West Coast offense, they are a down-the-field passing team, and this requires pass protection. It requires time for the quarterback, something McNabb was not given in the games against the ‘Boys.
Tim Kawakami of the San Jose Mercury News wonders whether the 49ers might call the Eagles about acquiring McNabb:
If you’re the 49ers, would you call up the Eagles in March and check to see if you can pry loose Donovan McNabb for a 2010 second-round pick? No way I’d give up either of their No. 1s, but for a No. 2… Worth a thought, if Philly’s interested. The Eagles have Kevin Kolb and Michael Vick, both free agents in a year (if they keep Vick). McNabb’s contract is also up after a year, so he’d need a large extension to go with any trade, which lessens his trade value dramatically.
ESPN.com's John Clayton says don't be so quick to write off McNabb playing in Philly next season:
He's not done yet. There are lot of people who want to run McNabb out of town. That would be a mistake. If Brett Favre retires, there will be a trade market for McNabb if the Vikings make the right offer. Favre is an interesting comparison. I don't think Kolb is as talented as Aaron Rodgers, but you saw what happened to the Packers once Favre left. They fell to 6-10, even though Rodgers threw for more than 4,000 yards.
Matt Bowen of the National Football Post thinks Buffalo could be a good fit for Michael Vick:
I can’t see any way that the Eagles bring Vick back and pay him the money he is owed next season to continue to act as a gadget player in the Philly version of the spread option. He is too good of a player for that and too good of a quarterback to be wasted lining up in the wildcat. Vick needs a team that is going to allow him to become the starting quarterback, and the Bills do have some talent at the skill positions when we talk about WR Lee Evans and RBs Fred Jackson and Marshawn Lynch. Yes, the offensive line is a patchwork job, but with free agency and the draft, Buffalo can address those needs.
Bernie Miklasz of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch says Vick could bring a buzz back to the Rams:
Rams GM Billy Devaney was part of the Atlanta organization during Vick's career there and visited Vick in prison. Rams coach Steve Spagnuolo and offensive coordinator Pat Shurmur are former assistants to Eagles coach Andy Reid and they trust his judgment. If Reid recommends Vick, Spagnuolo will listen.
Charley Walters of the St. Paul Pioneer Press mentions the Vikings in the McNabb conversation if Brett Favre retires:
It appears Philadelphia might consider trading QB Donovan McNabb, 33, whom Vikings coach Brad Childress had as Eagles offensive coordinator under pal/head coach Andy Reid. But it would seem highly unlikely that the Eagles would allow McNabb to go to another NFC team.
If Vick and or McNabb leaves they will have great careers wherever they go. I wish them both well in life as players and as human beings. They will both be fine. Mr. Vick understands what he needs to do and will do it. People dont want to give him any credit for the changes he has made in his life and that is fine. God and those that want to see it do. Mr. Vick and his finacee were a blessing to the community they lived in and will be wherever he goes.— Blessed8251- even though it will not be posted by anyone's comments, player for player the Cowboys have better talent. So before you throw 5 off the bus, remember that it takes a team to win, and a team to lose. I personally would prefer that Donovan stays and the coaching staff gets a kick in the tookus that a balanced offense will win.— mortgage_wizard
- It is amazing how the writers in Philadelphia want players gone. Taking polls of school kids taking any kind of poll of fans. Mr. Lurie did not get to where he is by listening to want-to-be coaches and fans making decisions about who goes and stays. What a bunch of losers these sports writers are.— Blessed8251
I resent "fans will blame McNabb because its the easy thing to do" ... don't insult a Philly sports fan's intel, Mike. Don't need your advice anyway. I vote for Freire Charter's #1 reason, "he's corny." LOL.— gho_matt- after all is said and done, I think Donovan is staying put. I agree 100% with Mike Lombardi's evaluation that the Eagles have been losing to Dallas because they are losing the batttles on the line of scrimmage and not because of McNabb. The only way I'd consider moving McNabb is for a top 10 first rounder paired with a 3rd rounder. I say build the defense into a bigger, stronger, harder hitting team and see where it takes us. And trade Vick for a 2nd rounder to Buffalo, Cleveland or St. Louis.— bradco
- I've felt for a while that though I like him, if Andy can catch a #1 pick from somebody drafting in the second half of teams, or a #2 from somebody in the first half....GO FOR IT! We saw enough of Kolb to form a decent opinion of him: ZERO "escapability", but accurate with a good variety of passes. He WILL however throw more picks than Mc5, so get used to that. I'm also unimpressed with his decision making,ie: like Donovan, he hangs on to the ball too long before throwing it away! He does NOT have Mc5's "quicks", and will get caught with the ball too often. But if the O-Line gets it's stuff together next year, and Andy runs the ball enough (mmmph, snicker!) I think Kolb could possibly get us to the playoffs. And IF the defense can be fixed to the point where it would be slightly above NFL average, we might contend for the Division crown. Oh yeah, almost forgot: Vick should fetch a #2 pick from a higher drafting-type team. And we gotta go find AJ Feeley and get him back here as our #2 QB!— TBear
- If Kurt Warner decides to retire, I wouldn't be surprised if Arizona makes an offer to acquire McNabb from the Eagles.— TripleOption
- Arizona has Leinhart. I don't see them giving up on him so soon.— P Even
Comment removed.- "We gotta go find AJ Feeley..." Uh, yeah right.— p-diddy
- Reid and McNabb have been together 11 years and have won a lot of games but no Super Bowl. If you're OK with being a contender every year but no SB win then keep them both. If your goal is to win a SB then one probably needs to go. The definition of 'insanity' clearly applies to the Eagles.— butchcat
- What is TBear refering to on McNabb's quicke. It cann't be his throws because he holds on to the ball waiting for the BIG pass and then gets sacked.— tulsaphil
- It seems that now is the time to trade him. He could get injured and then the team and Donnie are both done. So while apparently healthy, trade him for a low No. 1 or two picks in the 2nd. But, the team needs much more to now compete than one 33 yr. old QB. If Kolb stays, the money for Vick as No. 2 will not be that much. And if someone wants to give the Birds a low No. 1 or a high No. 2, Vick goes too. There might be a Tebow when the Birds draft in the 3rd since so many teams seem to dis him. I would not.— KGKoons
- I hope (and expect) the Eagles to bring McNabb back. The offense has gotten far on smoke-and-mirrors season after season, but it's always had gaps -- gaps that the very best defenses have been able to exploit. McNabb is good in the way all good quarterbacks are good: if you give him time in the pocket, he will eventually find his receivers and make plays. But, if the offense line can't be consistent, and, relatedly, if we still can't field a vaguely credible running game, then the better defenses will tend to get the better of the offense.— chaunceygardiner
- Great piece Sheil. You must have spent hours putting it all together. You have that "cut and paste" function down pat. Let's face it..McNabb's not going anywhere next year. Deep down, you know this. Please try writting something with a little bit of substance. You're getting a little too tabloid.— misplacedeaglefan
- I've always liked #5 but frankly I am tired of the throws at receivers feet and behind them. IF and that is a BIG if we can find a sucker,er team to trade a #1 I do it in a heartbeat. 33 is on the downside,big time. There are exceptions but I don't believe McNabb is capable of winning the SB and it won't get any better although I do give him credit for being the Eagles all time best QB. Let's move on.— Hatfield_ham
- A bunch of little spoiled brats at a charter school or ESPN analysts...hmmmmm...who should we listen to????!!!!— dr.elektrika
- Comment removed.
- McNabb has been a very good quarterback for the Eagles and a great addition to this city as a person. We are fortunate that he has played his career here in Philadelphia. However, the Eagles are not in a position to win a Super Bowl in the next year or two. Unless they spend a ton of money on free agents and totally revamp their defense, at best we are a first round and out playoff team. This is not McNabb's fault but it is the truth. We have young players on offense and a quarterback in Kolb that was drafted to be our QB of the future. Now is the time to move McNabb and give Kolb a chance. It doesn't matter if we struggle for a year or two. The key is to be a great team when Jackson, Maclin, Mccoy, etc. are reaching their prime. The defense will be rebuilt through the draft and ready to go in a few years. Last thing, Vick must go. He is a terrible quarterback. People complain about McNabb's accuracy yet over their careers, Vick's completion percentage is even worse. He is one of the most overrated players in football history.— phillyk7
- Eagles failure to win a super bowl is mostly because of the defense giving up 20+ points every time they get to the playoffs.— bobbyd24
- I agree with Mike Lombardi's analysis.— PhillyfaninChicago
- First of all you will not get a first round pick for McNabb, especially not in the first half of the draft. Second of all, he doesn't play for the city...he plays for the team. Yes he has shortcomings...but it doesn't matter that the city doesn't like us and he can take us to the promised land.— ceocreates
- Retired FB Fred McCrary came back home to Naples, FL today and received the Key To The City for his accomplishments in the NFL. Fred stated he talks regularly with his good friend and ex falcon QB, Vick and says Vick will be leaving the Eagles and will be looking for a starting QB position with another NFL team. You read it here first.— Mark1npt
- Retired FB Fred McCrary came back home to Naples, FL today and received the Key To The City for his accomplishments in the NFL. Fred stated he talks regularly with his good friend and ex falcon QB, Vick and says Vick will be leaving the Eagles and will be looking for a starting QB position with another NFL team. You read it here first, Sheil.— Mark1npt
- Looking at past history, the Eagles will deal McNabb, Vick, and Westbrook as they are all at the top of the curve. They should pick up at least 4-5 extra picks in the draft. And knowing the cheapskate Eagles, they would prefer 2nd and 3rd round picks....— DerbyBound
- They drafted Kolb in the first round, they have been developing him for 4 years when then do you use him? Mcnabb was a much better QB when he ran n threw. As a pocket passer he is horrible. Lombardi is right with Mcnabb, there a down the field passing team. With Kolb they look like a west coast offence. Prime example when Kolb was in there Celek caught a ton of passes n was leading the leaque for TE's. When Mcnabb is in there where is Celek blocking that's where. Mcnabb hardly plays full seasons he gets hurt to often. This is the time to move Vick n Mcnabb n get something for them. Cleveland, Buffalo, Arizona, Vikings our all possible. We need help in the trenches,free safety n corners. Broncos might need n experinced QB we could use Marshall. Big go to receiver on 3rd down would be great. New offensive coordinator with commitment to the run. Finally the young guns don't want to play 4 Mcnabb, when he threw them under the bus,after the Dallas game that was the last straw. They won't come out n say it directly but if you can't feel that vibe you shouldn't be a coach. We can still rebuild n be competitive, time for Kolb or some other young QB.— CRAZY DEGO
- Hey Blessed - Jeff Lurie got to where he was today via the $400M that he inherited from his family...he didn't earn a dime of it before buying the Eagles in his mid 40s.— Dean1
- McNabb's an OK qb, but not a great one. Kolb will not be as good as Aaron Rodgers but has a decent chance of being as good as McNabb was this past year, which was mediocre. See Tommy Lawlor's post on The Scout's Notebook about McNabb's performance. He supports trading McNabb now. I wish there was an additional year left in both Kolb and McNabb's contracts so the choice could be made a year later, but it is what it is. IMO The Eagles aren't going to the Superbowl next year with McNabb as the starter (and Reid as the HC), in fact they will be hard pressed to make the playoffs. It is better to trade him and Vick for some upgrades (mostly on D) and let Kolb take the reins. McNabb should get us at least one first rounder and another high pick.— ml307n
- "So I started with an informal poll: Raise your hand if you want Donovan McNabb gone.Raise your hand if you want the Eagles to keep McNabb. The results: 30 of 39 students want him gone (77 percent)." Well, there you have it. My exit polling shows that while 30 of 39 raised their hands that they want him gone, 12 were actually picking their nose, and 4 were just stretching. Of the remaining 14, 8 thought the economy would improve if McNabb left, citing logic propagated by their parents - and 95% of Philly sports talk hosts. Oh yeah, 32 of 39 raised their hands that they wanted him to stay. My investigative team also uncovered that these kids were passing fourth grade, which makes them smarter than 57% of the local media, and 76% of the posters on this site.— MG44
- Comment removed.
- McNabb is a bubble market...time to cash in while there is still value. Pick up some mid and late round picks for Vick. Invest these picks on the D (CB/DT) and O line. Kolb (Garcia back up) is the best path forward because it will force AR to run the ball more often. He calls a different game when McNabb is out. Unfortunately, this won't happen. AR and 5 are like an old married couple; they hold hands to keep from strangling each other. Each is afraid that the other will find happiness (read SB) as soon as they leave. AR fears 5 will have success if he gets traded to a system that knows how to properly use McNabb (sparingly) and 5 is afraid that the next QB will have stats similar to his, busting the HOF myth. Data to this point shows 5 should be afraid of this outcome. Please note that any resemblance between this post and a 6:15 AM is purely coincidental.— Joe Funk
- Lombardi is on target in talking about Eagles/Boys matchups and the Eagles *not* being a West Coast offense. With Kolb they might shift in that direction, but McNabb just isn't good enough in the short passing game, and it makes sense to take plenty of shots downfield with his arm and ability to buy time. But that's not a dependable offense, and the Cowboys took away their time to make big plays.— tacklinjoe
- I like McNabb. He's a damn fine quarterback and would have been greater if under an ownership/management that would spend MONEY to buy better quality players. We get talented players here/there bolstered by cheap wanna-be's that can't make the grade. Face it, you want a quality team? SPEND QUALITY MONEY!!!— Radar
- Comment removed.
- 2010 is an ugly schedule for the Eagles. Team was riddled with injuries in 2009. Adding Jackson & Maclin allowed McNabb to play long-ball passing which was very addictive for Mornhinweg & Reid. McCoy while impressive for a rookie showed none of the astounding play-making talent that set Westbrook apart as an RB. McDermott might be a whiz at defensive football theory, but he was schooled by Saints, Raiders, Bronco and Cowboys on practical applications. With Vick finally back in football shape--the hedge might be trading Kolb while McNabb starts ( and gets injured at some point) with Vick in the wings. Whatever they do--2010 is a very tough schedule--— Smashmouth
- Charlie Manson Vick, Bozo the clown McNabb, Workmans comp fraud Andrew sisters--l would be a single, 2 a double, 3 a triple, 4 a HOMERUN when they are outta Philly. Nice knowing you, have a good life, don't let the door hit you.— jwatson
- These philly writers are a disgrace at least some of them...I agree with the writer that said the battle was with the offensive and defensive lines..Mcnabb, just like Peyton Manning, Tony Romo, Tom Brady and any other top quarterback in the league struggled this year against a 3-4 defense..Its not just him.. By far the Eagles offensive line is the worse of all the quarterback teams I just named.— eaglesfanntx
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