Listomania

Three lists to argue over while driving to Nebraska:

Premiere Magazine picks the 20 Most Over-rated films. How could have they have missed 2001? a Throwing Things reader asks.

Atlantic Magazine picks the 100 most influential Americans. Lots of people you find on bills and coins. But ... "Lists are for groceries," write David & Barbara on the Atlantic's Web site, wondering about the value of any list in which Michael Jordan, Tiger Woods, Martha Stewart, Chuck Berry and Hef got votes.

Time Magazine picks the 100 best albums. No "Blood on the Tracks." No "Dark Side of the Moon." And, notes a Suburban Guerrilla commenter, no entry from any band with the name Dave in the title. (But there are two essentials from a dude named David.)

Much to chew on.

Premiere doesn't shy from controversy, picking the "over-rated" Jules and Jim, The Wizard of Oz, Fantasia and American Beauty in addition to easy marks like Forrest Gump, which my mother walked out of for its depiction of Vietnam war protesters.

About Moonstruck, Premiere's executive editor Kathy Heintzelman wrote: The speed with which Nicolas Cage's Ronny (whom a character calls "the most tormented man," as if that were a good thing) proclaims his love for Cher's Loretta would startle even Tom Cruise and Katie Holmes.

Throwing Things credits the magazine for grilling a few sacred cows, and then adds its own offering of "Dances With Wolves," "The Aviator" and a "Fish Called Wanda."

Time's CD lists came out earlier in the month, and Suburban Guerrilla fussed at it for not including any Laura Nyro. No argument here.

Commenter davminnj found some essentials missing:

where's john wesley harding?
face to face?
forever changes?
two steps from the blues?
tonight's the night?
another green world?
the circle game?
pretzel logic?
i absolutely cherish otis blue-but how could they then have left off the immortal otis redding?

Suburban Guerrilla commenter Izquierdo piled on:

And the ignorance/arrogance of them to define
"music" in such a jaw-droppingly limited way
— a grand total of two jazz albums, no classical,
no world music, nothing electronic, no musical
theater, no folk, no music of social protest,
no film music, nothing from the
first six decades
of recording history, et cetera, et cetera,
et cetera, as the King of Siam liked to say.
and if they can pick london calling, then why not x- wild gift?

(Collage by Nick Rubin)

He'd asked earlier, Who cares what current Time staffers think? One of those picking, however, has some taste. Alan Light was editor of Tracks and Spin before that - and a Rolling Stone writer before that. I'm guessing the Eminem comes from Light.

Another unhappy listener, Kevin Hayden, laid waste to the list noting a few critical absense:

Consider who's been left off:
Buddy Holly
Blind Faith
Cream
Eric Clapton
CSN or CSN&Y
early Stones
Mamas & Papas
Eric Burdon & The Animals
Loving Spoonful
Robert Cray
BB King
Pink Floyd
Moody Blues
Traffic
KD Lang
Temptations
Marianne Faithful
MC Hammer
James Taylor
Herbie Hancock
Ike & Tina (or Tina)
Mariah Carey
Joan Baez
Peter, Paul & Mary
The Righteous Brothers
Barry White
the better albums of Stevie Wonder than the two weak ones they chose
The Police
The Cars
Journey
Eurythmics/Annie Lennox
Arrested Development
Village People
Rare Earth
Leon Russell
Quicksilver
Johnny Cash
Patsy Cline
Foreigner
Yes
Queen
Sarah McLaughlin
Creedence Clearwater Revival
Jan & Dean
Christina Aguilera
Janis Joplin
ELO
The Supremes
The Four Tops
Gladys Knight
Patti Labelle
Jefferson Airplane/Starship
Mothers of Invention
Arlo Guthrie
Pink
Byrds
Yardbirds
Todd Rundgren
Dixie Chicks
Men At Work
Linda Ronstadt
Dionne Warwick
Red Hot Chili Peppers
Mahavishnu Orchestra
Los Lonely Boys
Jethro Tull
Donna Summer
Earth, Wind & Fire
Beyonce
Boyz in the Hood
Billy Joel
Squirrel Nut Zippers
Neil Diamond
The Monkees
Boston
The Doors

Oh, baby. Did he say Billy Joel?

The list was not just for "best" but most influential. By any standard, Billy Joel was influential. (Plus, I happen to think "The Nylon Curtain" was a perfect album.)

How do I say this? If I found Billy Joel in a prospective love-interest's record collection, it was discovering her qiana shirts. A troubler.

Absolutely the worst list I've ever seen. What the heck is Time doing?  Their Time Warner Classic Collections that they pimped through half hour infomercials with out of work "VJ'S" have better picks - than their actual list.  Where's Doc Watson's Memories, Leo Kotkee's MudLark - was there any Coltrane, Monk, Mondern Jazz Quartet.  Oh I guess Coltrane wasn't influential enough.  Even Mike Mather fans know "Love Supreme".  That list completely sucks - it's unbelievable - and where the heck is the Allman Brothers Band - they only spawned a whole genre and are still touring and kicking out unbelievable and inspired music. But not worthy of Time's list - sheer ignorance!  Come on influential even Mike Mathers legions know "Filmore East" - No Dead - where's Working Man's Dead - how about Airplanes Surrealistic Pillow?  Where's the Prog Rock - or Clannad.  Bob Marley gets "Legend" - that came after he was dead - what's so influential about a greatest hits album.  Try Exodus or Natty Dread - you blithering idiots!

No Dark Side - unbelievable!

Time as out of touch as ever and official apologist of the Status Quo - yuck - who reads that rag anyway?

"Who reads that rag...?"

Exactly, Paul.  The list is as irrelevant as the magazine, so what does it matter?
No list is ever going to be comprehensive. No accounting for tastes.
Such things are only created to create buzz.

Mission accomplished.

2001 is one of the finest films ever made.  I dare anyone to take on Nietzsche better than Kubrick.