Torture doesn't work, Part No. 161 -- weekend open thread

Have I said this before: That torture isn't just immoral and illegal, but it doesn't work. Here's even more evidence, in case you needed any:

WASHINGTON — The first use of waterboarding and other rough treatment against a prisoner from Al Qaeda was ordered by senior Central Intelligence Agency officials despite the belief of interrogators that the prisoner had already told them all he knew, according to former intelligence officials and a footnote in a newly released legal memorandum.

In fact:

Abu Zubaydah had provided much valuable information under less severe treatment, and the harsher handling produced no breakthroughs, according to one former intelligence official with direct knowledge of the case. Instead, watching his torment caused great distress to his captors, the official said.

Even for those who believed that brutal treatment could produce results, the official said, "seeing these depths of human misery and degradation has a traumatic effect."

What's worse -- trashing America's values and reputation, or trashing America's values and reputation for nothing? Discuss. It's the weekend open thread, so all topics are on the table, even those depressing Phillies and Flyers.