Well played, Ruben
Why the trade for Cliff Lee makes so much sense for the Phillies.
Well played, Ruben
Rich Hofmann, Daily News Sports Columnist
I wanted Roy Halladay. You wanted Roy Halladay. Some people said they didn't care what it took to get him. But, well, come on. There had to be some limit, right?
Now it will be Cliff Lee and right-handed bat Ben Francisco, in exchange for Carlos Carrasco, Jason Knapp, Lou Marson and Jason Donald. Lee is not Halladay. Carrasco & Co. are not Kyle Drabek, Jay Happ and Dominic Brown. These are both true facts. The Phillies and their rookie GM, Ruben Amaro Jr., played this right.
Long-term, we all can agree that the Phils are in better shape than if they had traded Drabek and Brown as part of the package to get Halladay. That isn't to say that Carrasco won't be useful and that Knapp -- a big kid with a huge fastball -- won't end up being very, very good. This wasn't theft. The Phillies did give up four players who could very well end up being major-league contributors. But they kept their big pieces -- Drabek, Brown and Michael Taylor. Again, long-term, this is clearly a win.
Short-term -- ignoring Francisco, a need -- we can boil everything down to this question: which would you rather have in October, Halladay alone or the combination of Lee and Happ?
Let's take an opening-round series against San Francisco as one example. In Game 1, you would have Tim Lincecum against either Lee or Halladay. Neither would have a clear-cut advantage over the other. If each man pitched to expectations, the game likely would be decided in the bullpen -- Halladay or Lee, doesn't matter. Now, go to Game 4. In one case, if they trade for Halladay, it is Moyer/Martinez/Lopez vs. whatever able-bodied guy the Giants can find (remember, Randy Johnson is on the 60-day DL, scrambling everything). Again, you are likely looking at a game decided in the bullpen. In the other case, with the Lee trade, you still have Happ and you suddenly have a clear advantage in Game 4.
Again, if you want to argue that Lee isn't Halladay, that's fair. But the differences are incremental, not enormous. The fact that you get to keep Happ turns incremental into something even smaller, and maybe shrinks the difference to nothing. Again, that's in the short-term.
Now, if Halladay ends up in Boston, the conversation might change. But between then and now, Amaro played this exactly right.
Trading the future for Halladay might have given us a series repeat this year but then 5 plus years of beiung in the middle of the pack. If we can get some bullpen help and a relacement for the bearded one in a utility roll that bats more than he weights we should do great not only this year but next year and we kept Drabek and the two youngesters in the outfield. I also feel this will help us keep Blanton and Pedro Feliz for another few years . The unknown factor is Brett Myersd and can he come back and help in the pen down the strtch because we have no closer at this point. Lidge has been terrible. We need a 4 room lead going into the 9th to fel halfway safe. We will lose Matt Stairs and Scott Eyre to retirement after this year but they should be avble to be replaced for next year.We can also send Mayberry back down to Lehigh Valley and let him play everyday. He is not a bench type player or we can use him as part of a deal before weeks end. Good job Reuben. hwould have been wonderful but not for what Toronto was asking. Now we have 5 starters plus Pedro Martinez if he shows anything.Thats a bonus.Maybe Myers will help in the pen the las month. we need help there to repeat.— naplesbear- Halladay > Lee + Happ. I am happy to see the team improved, but disappointed by the lack of killer instinct (assuming they are done shopping). IMO prospects are prospects. Last year Donald and Carrasco were the bomb, this year its Drabek and Brown, neither who have been close to AAA. Bottom line, the Phillies had the inside track on acquiring the most consistently dominant, shut down pitcher in baseball- which is what you want in the post season. They passed to save $10 million in salary. Cheap, cheap, cheap.— jtj06
I grade it M for Magnificent. And I also agree with ag (see above post). Our back-end of pen (circa 2009) is a disaster waiting to happen in the post season. Sherrill would be a huge upgrade. And I feel it will happen: Sherrill (or Qualls) for (sorry bout this ) J.A. Happ. Tonight's game at Zona will be 1/3 D-Back fans, 1/3 Phillies fans and 1/3 Oriole and D-Back scouts watching J.A. with their radar guns perfectly calibrated. Great trade Ruben, thanks for giving us a "present" and a future...— Tempmike- good trade. lidge is the problem now and it's a huge one. get some back-end help or it will not matter who your starters are come playoff time when lidge is blowing up...— john dorian
- Let's not forget that this deal may be better in the long term too. With Myers coming off the books this year and Moyer next [assuming they don't re-sign Myers], they can try to sign Lee to a nice long term deal using that money. Doubt they'd even have a chance to re-sign Halladay after next year. But if they can re-sign Lee, that sets them up with Lee, Hamels, Blanton, Happ and Drabek for 2010 and, quite possibly, beyond.— jmk1512
- Cleveland fans are furious and feel they got robbed.....here's the link, and all the messages below....some are hilarious: http://www.cleveland.com/tribe/index.ssf/2009/07/cliff_lee_ben_francisco_headed.html Great job , Ruben !!— solexy
- The Philles have 2 Aces and a pair of MVP's. Bet the farm and suck out the third Ace and see if anyone can beat a Full-House!— jlhocken
- I never wanted Halladay. The Lee deal was a great move. I've said this all along, the Phillies don't need Roy Halladay. The Phils needed someone solid and dependable. Cliff Lee is more than solid, and they didn't have to give up the farm to get him. Job well done, Rube.— p-diddy
- It will be great when we lose the World Series in 5 games, of which Halladay will be pitching for Boston to win Games 1 and 5. Cliff Lee is 7-9 and has given up the most hits of any AL pitcher this season. Unless Lee can go 9 innings everytime, we still don't have a RELIABLE closer.— springfieldzoo
- So, how does the starting pitching line up? Lee'ss regular turn looks like its Friday. Does Blanton get pushed back a day? Does this move a very effective so far Lopez (or Moyer) to the bullpen to replace a pretty ineffective Durbin, or do they trade Lopez and or Moyer? What happens when and if Pedro pitches well? Where do they put him?— bobcitydoc
- Like you said playoffs are often decided in the bullpen. With Lidge we're in BIG trouble. Look at how many post season appearances he had last year and was flawless. That's not going to happen this year. We're in trouble without a different closer.— dabirds
- I think people would be complaining regardless of what Amaro did. This is a good smart deal that brings the Phillies a number one for the next two years, gives Cole Hamels a chance to solidify his claim to no. 1, and makes for one hell of a rotation if Lee doesn't stay. Did anyone think that Halladay would stay around after next year, get real. If Lee decides not to stay we could be looking at Hamels, Drabek and Savery and team wouldn't be headed off the tracks when the nucleous starts to leave. Nice job Ruben and good post Rich.— Mickey0123
- I wonder if "future Phillies star" Lou Marson bothered to show up to sign autographs at the card store in Havertown tonight? What great timing...— bobcitydoc
Rube is no Rube! Way to not blink and not give away the future!— COskier
I wanted Roy Halladay— primo
