CINCINNATI - Charlie Manuel has always said he is a "stuff" kind of guy. If a pitcher is throwing his pitches to the best of his ability, the Phillies manager likes his chances.

In Manuel's opinion, the last two outings, Brett Myers hasn't had his best stuff.

"I've seen him have much better stuff," Manuel said after Myers allowed four runs on eight hits in five innings. "Let's put it like that."

Myers agreed with that assessment after his first start of the season, but he didn't think he had a similar problem yesterday.

"I feel like I had really good stuff today," he said. "I made some good pitches that they didn't offer at."

Myers admitted he made some mistakes. One was a 1-1 breaking ball to Ken Griffey Jr. in the first inning that the future Hall of Famer crushed into the rightfield seats for his 594th career home run. The second was a 3-1 pitch to Jeff Keppinger in the third inning that the shortstop hit over the leftfield fence for a solo homer.

All in all, though, Myers was happier with the way he threw compared to Opening Day, when he allowed four runs in an 11-6 loss to the Nationals.

Myers logged 95 pitches yesterday before he was pulled after the fifth for the second straight game. Myers felt like he could have pitched the sixth, but the Phillies replaced him with Clay Condrey.

"Today I was very frustrated because I definitely felt like I had another inning in me and wasn't happy with the way the situation ended up," Myers said. "I mean, I gave up two seeing-eye singles in that [fifth] inning and had to work out of a bases-loaded jam, but felt like I deserved myself another inning there and they didn't give it to me. They felt like I was finished and they needed to go to the bullpen."

Manuel, however, thought Myers' fastball was lacking. He said the righthander's velocity was lower than the range at which he normally throws.

"His fastball was sitting 89, 90, every now and then he touched 91," Manuel said. "He's usually a 90-to-94 guy.

"I've seen better velocity on his fastball," Manuel added. "Today he was throwing some breaking balls and looked like he was throwing splits, a changeup every now and then, mixing the fastball in, but he didn't have the velocity or the command on the fastball that he usually has."

Manuel said he didn't have an explanation for the lack of speed, but said it had nothing to do with Myers' return to the rotation after a year of closing.

"I don't know," Manuel said. "Maybe it's just how he feels."

But Myers said he felt fine. Instead, he pointed to Reds third baseman Edwin Encarnacion's at-bat in the fifth inning that illustrated his struggles. After falling behind 2-0, Myers battled back with two straight strikes.

He threw a 2-2 slider that started in the zone before dipping down at the last second. It's a pitch Myers thought Encarnacion would usually swing at. But Encarnacion didn't budge. Instead, he took it for ball three and eventually walked.

"I thought I made some quality pitches down in the zone that usually get offered at, but they weren't swinging at it today," said Myers, who said he thought he might be tipping his pitches.

"It's never a step forward when you lose," he said. "I felt like my stuff was better today, but I just didn't get the swings at the pitches I was looking for. I thought that location on my fastball was there at times but wasn't at other times, but that's no excuse. I felt like I had good stuff and I should have pitched better than that."

Lidge's debut

One positive for the pitching staff yesterday was the return of Brad Lidge, who struck out one while pitching a perfect eighth. Granted, it wasn't a save situation, but the new closer said he was happy with the way he threw.

Lidge reported no pain in his surgically repaired knee. The next step is to see whether he can pitch today on no days' rest if called upon.

"Any time you have to have surgery in spring training, you have to push yourself to get back as fast as possible, but at the same time you don't want to do anything that's going to make you stay out longer," said Lidge, who underwent arthroscopic knee surgery Feb. 25. "It's been tough, but our trainers have been fantastic . . . we've worked hard. Obviously, this is just the first game of the season, and hopefully I'll be throwing in a lot more."

Hamels back

Cole Hamels says he thinks the mound at the Great American Ballpark is the highest mound in the National League. That's a good thing for the Phillies, who are counting on the young lefthander to stop their two-game slide today against Reds ace Bronson Arroyo.

Hamels has had a lot of success in Cincinnati. Last April, he pitched arguably his best game as a pro, striking out 15 and allowing one run on five hits in a win over the Reds.

"It was just one of those days where I could have closed my eyes and I was going to hit my spot," Hamels said.

Hamels was already in day-of-game mode following yesterday's loss. Asked about the prospect of putting the team on his arm today, he replied, "No comment."

Helms gone

The Phillies traded third baseman Wes Helms to the Marlins on Saturday for cash considerations. The Phillies will be responsible for paying a significant amount of the $2.9 million owed to Helms (this year's salary plus a $750,000 buyout next year), but it isn't clear how much.

Benson update

Kris Benson will throw a bullpen session today and then another one in the middle of the week as he continues to work his way back from shoulder soreness. There is no indication when he might pitch another minor league game. *