Charlie and The Lineup Factory
After the front office added two new everyday players, Phillies manager Charlie Manuel takes a stab at the lineup.
Charlie and The Lineup Factory
The last time Charlie Manuel addressed the Phillies beat scribes, we were all in Nashville having lunch and the front office hadn't done a thing to improve the roster.
But just before Manuel and Co. boarded a plane bound for Philly on Thursday, Manuel knew there was a very good chance he had two new pieces for his starting lineup. The Phils traded for center fielder Ben Revere and were awaiting word for Michael Young to accept the third base job.
On Monday, with most of his starting nine accounted for, Manuel tried to take a stab at his 2013 batting order.
"You know, when I think about it, Michael Young, I can hit him quite a few places," Manuel began. "And in the year, two years, Ben has mostly hit second. But, you know what. I can sit here and go over lineups all I want to, but when it really gets down to it, who we have on the corners and in the outfield, that's what is going to dictate where our lineup falls. You can say whatever you want to, but if you're going to have production, as far as RBI and runs scored..."
Like you, Manuel is waiting for the next move. And if history is any indication, there will be another move.
The Phils aren't going to run the foursome of Domonic Brown, Darin Ruf, Laynce Nix and John Mayberry Jr. into the final two spots in their outfield. After trying to fill one corner outfield spot with question marks in each of the last two seasons, there is no chance they go into 2013 with two question marks in the corners.
In 2011, the Phils hoped to replace departed free agent Jayson Werth with Domonic Brown. But Brown got hurt early in spring training, Ben Francisco struggled and the team eventually traded for Hunter Pence.
In 2012, the Phils hoped to replace departed free agent Raul Ibanez with John Mayberry Jr., who finished the previous season on a tear. But Mayberry never took hold of the job when the season began and was out-played by Juan Pierre, a limited veteran who played above the minor league contract he signed last winter.
The Phils could platoon one of those two spots in 2012 - say, Brown and Ruf in left. But they know they need a proven bat in the other spot, and after going cheap in center, they have money to spend, too.
Among the outfield bats still on the free agent market: Josh Hamilton, Nich Swisher and Cody Ross.
Since Charlie won't entertain a lineup until all of the pieces are in place, here's one man's guess. (I'm sticking Carlos Ruiz in there since he will be back as the team's regular catcher following a 25-game suspension).
1. Jimmy Rollins, SS
2. Michael Young, 3B
3. Chase Utley, 2B
4. Ryan Howard, 1B
5. Carlos Ruiz, C
6. Free Agent, RF
7. Darin Ruf/Domonic Brown, LF
8. Ben Revere, CF
9. Pitcher
Ben Revere should lead off, he gets on base much more than JRoll...Utley 2nd...Young 3rd...Howard 4th...need Young 3rd to split up lefties Utley and Howard.— jim35- Please stop saying Revere gets on base more than Jimmy. JRoll has a career OBP higher than Revere. He gets more extra base hits than Revere. He stole 30 bases. He scores more runs. Revere may some day be a good leadoff hitter, but he's not better than JRoll at this point. Look at the facts before spewing shallow opinions. — cdedrick05
- Free Agent batting 6th would obviously presume Swisher/Ross
@jim: when you resign yourself to who WILL lead off, as opposed to who SHOULD lead off, it becomes a little easier to stomach. That's what my therapist says anyway.. - Batting Revere 8th doesn't make a lick of sense. Not a lick. Batting Rollins 6th DOES make sense to every warm body in the Tri-State region except Uncle Pappy.— Sam Crow
- Let's see, a guy who can't get on base bats lead off. Then the top ground in to double play guy who also can't get on base bats second. Batting 3rd, a guy who hits in the .250s. All three are among the oldest at their respective positions in baseball and thus are high injury risks (how was Amaro to know that many of the oldest players at their position would miss time with injuries?). And that's the TOP of the order. Get your playoff tickets now! — jtj06
- Rollins has a HIGHER career OBP than Revere. Rollins has a HIGHER career OPS, hits more extra base hits, scores more runs, and is the better player and hitter. Revere was a good addition to the team and is a perfect #8 hitter in the NL.
Let the people who know baseball more than you and Warbiscuit make the decisions about who bats where...— cdedrick05 - Right, because career OBP and what Jimmy did 10 years ago when he was 25 is REALLY relevant. JRoll's OBP over the last 4 years is .316 with a sweet .253 BA. That's a pretty good sample size and a decent view of where he's at right now at this stage of his career. And actually if you take last year from April thru August (when he capitalized on minor league callups with a late-season push) he was .302 OBP with a super awesome .242 BA. Revere last year -- his first full season in the majors, mind you -- had a .333 OBP and a .294 BA, not to mention he has the speed to run circles around Jimmy who is 10 years his senior. Maybe you should follow some other teams beyond the insular walls of Philadelphia and realize that Jimmy is really a No. 6 hitter on any championship caliber team. His ability to drive the ball to the gaps would actually play well there. As a table-setter for the lineup, he's mediocre at best. It's time to stop being afraid of settling for mediocre around here
- My Goodness, someone who knows how to "splain it" to em!! Keep it up Stik if you can stand the abuse you will take from the ,"Don't destroy my hero" mob mentality. Don't let them drive your opinions away. It is nice to read intelligent offerings based on knowledge and research. It is a shame the "Heart and Soul is Jimmy" bunch have such a big voice on here and most amazingly ,in the media. What is truly so astounding is that with them all shouting about the aging Phils they can't see it in Jimmy too and it is not a matter of dumping him but simply his place in the order that is what needs to change.
— DUDESKINS - Easy bud, I follow ALL of baseball. I know exactly who Revere is and what he can bring. I favor giving the MOST at bats to the MOST productive player over the course of a year. JRoll and his .760 OPS in 2012 (not 10 years ago) is more productive than Revere and his .660 OPS. Revere would have to steal 100 bags or more to match JRolls production from he top. Revere only had 25 extra base hits. Jimmy had 60. I think Revere could do a good job, and I like the Phil's having him....but right now JRoll is still the better option. My guess is that the Phillies feel the same way, but we'll see... — cdedrick05
- This team is looking more and more like the best case is 72-90 2013.
And since Amaro keeps getting rid of prospects, they'll be headed to the cellar for another decade in the h*ll of baseball.
Montgomery and the shadow ownership group seem determined to drive the Phillies into the ground as quickly as possible.— fmMD - "if history is any indication, there will be another move..." with baited breath, waiting for the next Wigginton, Schierholtz, Nix, Thome, Ben Francisco, Mayberry, Thome, Martinez, Bruntlett, Gload, etc equivalent..clueless rube sure knows how to spot talent— warbiscuit
- Maybe Carlos Pena. Dope — DogBiscuitthedope
- who could forget the great Bowker— warbiscuit
- Back under your rock moron — DogBiscuitthedope
- Isn't the object of a lead-off hitter to score runs? Jimmy scored 102 and Revere scored 70 last year.— prop03
