Holmgren relying on kids' growth
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Holmgren relying on kids' growth
Sam Carchidi, Inquirer Staff Writer
After listening to Flyers GM Paul Holmgren Thursday, I get the sense that _ unless other teams bring down their demands _ he will not be a player in the trading sweepstakes for Anaheim’s Bobby Ryan or Columbus’ Rick Nash.
In other words, the Flyers are not dealing promising centers Sean Couturier or Brayden Schenn.
Period.
Holmgren talked today after the Flyers signed winger Ruslan Fedotenko and defenseman Bruno Gervais, a pair of unrestricted free agents.
The Flyers still have the cap space to make a deal, but my sense is that they are committed to the kids _ they played 12 rookies last season _ and will give them another year to develop.
They can use that cap space to make a move during this season _ or have plenty of room next year, when the free-agent class is expected to include Shea Weber, Corey Perry and Ryan Getzlaf, among other marquee names. (Kimmo Timonen and Scott Hartnell will also be among the UFAs in 2013.)
“I really like our team,” Holmgren said, “and I’m hesitant to look at anything where I’ve got to give up something (important) to get something back. We have a lot of good young players that have tremendous potential. Quite frankly, I’m happy with our team right now. That doesn’t mean we won’t look and see what happens.”
Holmgen said the Flyers “took a couple swings for the fences early on in free agency” _ he was referring to Zach Parise and Ryan Suter _ “and those are adding players that you’re not taking away from your team. We had to slide to Plan B, and we’re happy with the players we got in Plan B.”
And happy to watch the youngsters mature and develop into (hopefully) stars.
Breakaways. Holmgren on not being able to resign Matt Carle, who went to Tampa Bay: “I’m disappointed, but we’ll move on. We tried hard to sign Matt.”….Holmgren said he spoke with Jaromir Jagr’s agent, Petr Svoboda, throughout the start of free agency. “I don’t know if he got antsy or what. I got a call late on the 3rd (of July) that he was getting excited and wanted to make a move, and I wasn’t prepared to do anything at that time," the GM said. "We still had offers out on the table that I wanted to wait on, and I wasn’t prepared to move on Jaromir at the time….and he wasn’t ready to wait.” Jagr signed with Dallas…..Holmgren said he doesn’t expect problems coming to an agreement with Jake Voracek, a restricted free agent. “I don’t want to put a timeline on it, but he’ll be signed at some point," he said.
Comments (44)
Welcome to 2006-07 apocalypse all over again...
Rusty Fedotenko = Kyle Calder
Luke Schenn = Steve Eminger
The difference is, neither Couturier nor Schenn are remotely as good as Richards...and Couturier might be better than Carter defensively, but he will never score like Carter...
This ain't gonna be pretty...especially with the coach behind the wheel...
— Dangler9- So in your expert opinion on the development of hockey prospects, Schenn (age 20) and Couturier (age 19), you've established that neither one will ever be as good as Mike Richards or Jeff Carter...That is after seeing them play in 63 and 77 games respectively. I'm glad you cleared that up for us and for them that way we can just get rid of them we can move on. As for the coach, I too think he is is a bumbling moron--seeing as he's coached teams to 2 stanley cups in 7 years (1-1)...but yes, he's completely awful. I think we should just fire everyone and let you coach and manage the franchise being that your hockey accumen is transcendent of the current professionals in the Flyers employ.
- Yes, he used to be a scout for the Manitoba turds in the fargo bush league. He's an expert, I can swear under oath.
- Yes, he used to be a scout for the Manitoba turds in the fargo bush league. He's an expert, I can swear under oath.
- "Rusty Fedotenko = Kyle Calder
Luke Schenn = Steve Eminger"
Those comparisons are about as big a stretch as they come.— camtheman - i love that he's not making moves just for the sake of doing it. keep the crew together for another year of learning, and hold the cash for a big pickup next summer. i'd take one "disappointing" season if it means eventually signing the best d-man in the league.— mrkmcc
- Disappointing season? On defense they lost Carle but added Schenn. On offense they lost Jagr and JVR, but growth (and Fedotenko) will make up for that. Plus, NJ and Pitt both are worse. — logicandreason
Comment removed.- Suter signed with Minnesota turd breath, Pittsburgh is the biggest bunch of thug failures I've ever seen on skate with a cry baby captain that choked.
- First, it's Suter and secondly, he signed with Minnesota. Pay attention! — camtheman
- Taking a shot at Ek with the "more to come" comment at the end?— vipers53
- Comment removed.
- Dangler: Don't sell Couturier short on his offense. He put up some pretty eye-opening #s in juniors, and did pretty well in his first full season campaign, notching 13 goals despite limited time playing mostly on the 4th line. To put those 13 goals in context, Carter scored 14 his second season (after 23 his first season), and Carter was playing on special teams with Forsberg.
- Call me crazy but I LOVE this stance. The future of this team is very bright. There is no substitute for the experience the young guys got last season and they and the Flyers will be better for it this coming season.
We'll miss Jagr's hard work on the boards and the influence on the young guys but now some of these young guys can spread their wings a bit more and maybe light the lamp at a greater rate.
We'll need Simmonds to at the very least, maintain his performance from last year. Hopefully he'll get better and show up more in the playoff's. You've got to think that Couturier and Schenn are going to get more points and with his speed and more opportunities, Matt Read could be a nice surprise.
There's still a question with the D until these guys get to play together, develop chemistry and all. And we all should expect that Timmo will miss some games next year. That dude is the man but he's fragile right now. So I wouldn't mind a run at another D man in this current FA period, but don't give up any of this promising young talent until you absolutely have to. And that time really doesn't come until trade deadlines next season.— brinks69 - Ducks will give up Bobby Ryan and his salary for a signed Jake V., young defenseman like Gust. OR M.A. Bourdon and a No 1 Rd.Dr.Ch.in 2013.— Romus
- @ Snipes - I love, love, love Couturier, but he ain't never gonna put up the empty 40+ of Carter...and back at you with Carter playing in a Hitchcock system his rookie year...not like this pond hockey junk that over-inflates regular season stats only to fail in the post season stuff.
— Dangler9 - Comment removed.
- Dangler, what are you talking about? You use an overly dramatic term like apocalypse and then refer to at least 1 minor player in the big picture.....4th liner Fedotenko, and even Luke Schenn, who will be an important part of the defense but is hardly expected to carry the team--thats your reference, for "apocalpyse"?--like, if Rusty Fedotenko underachieves, we got big problems? The stars and up and coming youngsters will carry the team, likely fairly well based on last year--If Giroux, Briere and others struggle, yes, we could have problem.....but Fedotenko and L Schenn.....huh?— btbenz
- While I agree the youngsters need to step up, the fact is the Flyers got career years (so far) out of Talbot, Hartnell and Simmonds. If they progress, great, but I just as easily could see them settling back to their usual career numbers and that will be another loss of offensive pop.
I think Schenn and Couturier have another 10-15 goals each in them with more time and responsibility. That might help make up for the loss of points from Jagr and JVR. I still think Homer jumped the gun too soon on the JVR trade and could have at least received a marginal offensive talent or draft pick with Schenn. That said, it's done and you have to live with it.
Offensive production from the defense will be worse than last year. Unless Lavy adjusts the system to fit the mostly stay-at-home talent on the blue line, Bryz and Leaky are going to be tested a lot.
Goaltending is a disaster and is worse than last year. Bringing Leighton back is not any more comforting. I'm hoping the CBA has the amnesty contract and the Flyers dump Bryz's existing contract and either try to renegotiate with him for a 2 year deal or go after another CBA contract casualty.— Repubrebirth - BT - I am refering to the 2006 off season...and then one of the darkest eras in Flyers history...the two big acquisitions that summer were Steve Eminger and Kyle Calder...and then the team emploded, Hitch was fired and Clarke quit.
That's how ugly this season will be if the roster stays this way.
Coach will stick with his system...without the guns to support it.
Defense has no rudder...Timonen, as much as I love him, is a #3 at best.
System + loss of two scorers + back 6 + Mr. Universe = apocalypse
The difference is that Homer could sell off Forsbroken for parts to build around Richards and Carter...— Dangler9 - I'll bet you are the kind of driver that creates a 6 mile back up driving 45 in the left lane on I 95. There is no comparison to the 2006 off season and this off season. Zilch zippo. Bobby Clark admitted he wasn't even trying or paying attention anymore the last 5 years of his tenure and Hitchcock lost his team that included binge drinkers Carter and Richards. Fast forward to 2012, where we have a nucleus of young talent developing together at just the right time with the best player in the NHL centering our 1st line and a top 5 goalie in net.
- my point is that what you are calling "big acquisitions" (implying important players) are not, and actually the reference is sort of ridiculous--no one would say that acquiring Fedotenko qualifies as a big acquisition (he'll likely be on the 4th line.....a solid depth guy, no more)--and Schenn basically replaces Carle, and I'm sure they got him as insurance in case Carle didn't sign.....nice pickup, young d-man but hardly a big acquisition--not sure how you draw the comparison to 2006. — btbenz
- More Kool-Aid, anyone?— jibberjabber
- AndyReidsbeard - you need to know the facts...
Lavy joined both teams in mid season.
Lavy's system had been out of hockey for over a year.
Both teams had a luxury of riches in scoring depth.
And the trump card - almost the entire forward group was turned over last season, yet the SAME EXACT RESULT- a second round exit where it looked like the Flyers were "slow".
How could that be?
I like Couturier.
Here's one for you on Schenn - the Kings had two camps to look at this kid...and then gave him up...and they clearly ain't dumb...and then coincidentally Schenn "struggled" with the Flyers...and then coincidentally he was moved to wing...and...and...and...you get the idea...
— Dangler9 - so by your rationale, bylsma taking over for therien or sutter taking over for murray automatically evaporates the fact that they won the cup?!??! C'MON MAN! Get real. They can win w/ the current system...tehy were 2 wins away from doing it...WITH MICHAEL F'NG LEIGHTON IN GOAL (an AHL goalie who happens to be back w/ the team, ugh.) As for Schenn, I thought he showed major improvements as the season wore on...Extremely physical in teh Pens series and made offensive contributions. Judging by the SCF winner and the way that series was played, stronger, physical play was the key. Every talking head in hockey had said Schenn was going to be Richards-esque player and it makes sense watching him. Relax with your impulse.
- Ryan would be good piece but only for something like Hartnell, Rinaldo, and Gust or Lillya…not 1st round pick! Don't trade the kids OR the 1st round picks.— connorjr
- Smart move homer!— fman727
- Dangler9, its shocking how little you "get". AndyReidsMustach summed it up best. What do the Flyers need to do to hire you? I mean wow, the Kings "gave up on Schenn" and gave him away to the flyers for Richards. So insightful and deep LOL. I guess Simmons was the key to that deal and Schenn was a throw in. Couturier played exactly one season as a teenager on the 4th line and you are able to sum up his career better than every hockey expert who thinks the world of the kid. Are you calling Jagr (19 goals) 1st line and pplay and JVR (11 goals) the "scores" we lost or are there 2 others? Go back to Brazzer's and leave the hockey analysis to others— Mottz
- Put in an RFA offer sheet to Weber...10 years, $110 mil and blow Nashville out of the water. He's worth it as the best D-man in the league and we can afford it. Yes, we lose a lot of draft picks (4), but we can make some of them back, especially in year's 3 and 4. Weber is at least worth 2 #1's in the last third of the round. We can then aggressively try to move Mez for either draft picks or a decent winger.
- The UFA list as of today is terrible. Slim pickins to say the least. Only thing left to do is trade and if the asking price is too high Homer will let it go and wait until the trade deadline if possible. That being said, If I had to give up some youth for a proven commodity I may do it. Homer said "I like our team" so look out!— NYPHILLYPHAN
- The Rangers have a couple of big boy fighters on their roster, the latest addition being Asham. The Islanders have Carkner, who is a monster. The Pens have their thugs and the Bruins, well they're always the Bruins. Even mild-mannered Montreal has some fighters now. But the Flyers? They need a certified heavyweight or two lest we see Wayne Simmons and Zac Rinaldo get their head pounded in game after game. Jody Shelley? Not going to get it done. Homer, find us a heavyweight.— schultz08
- Some of you guys just aren't happy unless you're sh****** your pants are you? Seriously? Its like this: Schenn makes up for Carle, Fedotenko more than makes up for old man Jagr. Only player we really haven't replaced is Pronger, and there is no Pronger out there to replace him with. Homer, you're the man right now. B*tchslap Bryz a little, then take him to Epcott center, and let him spend some time with his kids. Then get to work on getting Shea Webber, via trade this year or FA next.
He's your key big boy.
Also ignore 90% of the other Flyer's fans. Over emotional basketcases.— WestonF01 - Growth.....that is funny. Does the author realize that Hartnell, Giroux, Simmonds, and Talbot all had the best seasons of the careers? I expect only one of those 4 to continue his pace. Couturier is a balanced 2-way player who will never be an elite scorer. He will be a great player. His hockey IQ is some of the best I have ever seen from an 18 year old, but his skating will keep him from being a big scorer. Schenn is the opposite. Schenn can chip in 20 goals if given the chance...he still needs to earn that chance.
On this board, last season, everyone was applauding the trades of Carter/Richards for the freedom and cap space. Saying that it allowed them to sign players like Jagr, Read, and Bryzgalov. Now, complaints about Bryzgalov, loss of Jagr...Flyers are left with a pile of spendable cash sitting on the table, and no skilled forwards adding depth to this franchise. Meanwhile, the 2 traded centers have earned a day with the greatest trophy in sports.— Hexy4GM - LOL! Clearly, I have touched a nerve. Enjoy this season boys...it's gonna be a rough one.— Dangler9
- Cheers to Homer! Honestly, all people did was moan and groan about how good players get traded off to win elsewhere. Now Homer stands pat with a group of young players and people don't like that either. I applaud Homer for having Plan B = give these kids a chance!— mikeyo27
- Weston's right. Weber will be a Flyer by end of season.— RG
- Cheers to Homer; give me an effin break!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He blew the entire offseason. Cut payroll, lost key players and didn't sign anyone worth signing! Yeah, great job "Homer"!!!!! LMFAO— JBinPA
- Carle, JvR, Jagr, Kubina, Bobrovsky out
Schenn, Gervais, Fedotenko, Leighton in.
No matter how you slice it, it's a significant loss of size, skill, and depth.
The strenght of the team at forward has been weakened, and the weakness of the team at defense has been weakened further.
We've cashed in two valuable trade chips in JvR and Bobrovsky, and the roster has still taken a step backwards.— andyd - Homer makes it sound like waiting on Suter and Parise cost him the chance to try to keep Jagr. The Flyers will miss his skill but at $4.5 million he's overpriced. Plus, besides netting the GWG in Game 2 against Pittsburgh, Jagr was mostly invisible in the playoffs. The Flyers seem resigned to waiting until next summer to add a key piece. I'd like to see Weber in the Orange and Black.— Snap Crackle Propp
- Gotta give Homer credit for going after Parise and Suter aggressively. Obviously, it wasn't a money issue that ultimately decided for them. I think Schenn is a nice addition, and the kids will continue to get better. Hopefully, Timo stays healthy, in which case he's still as reliable a defenseman as there is. But, it really comes down to Bryz. If his head is screwed on straight and plays the way he's capable of, the Flyers should be a Cup contender. If not, they can't possibly be successful. Bobby Ryan would be a very nice addition, but would hate to have to give up Coutierier to get him.— Fan Forever
- I think Luke Schenn going to have a career year. I live in the Toronto area and the pressure on Laff players is crazy. Not to mention playing for Wilson. Stay the course Homer, keep some free cash for the trade deadline.— racsokitty
- I think the talent the Flyers have will pay dividends. Patience helps. Some people are still irked that Carter and Richards were shipped.
I went over Schenn's numbers again. He has limited playing time and was injured for huge chunks of the season. IF HE STAYS HEALTHY, with more playing time, he's a 25-goal player minimum, but with momentum from preseason, he could put up 30 goals. I expect both he and Cout to put up 22-27 goals next season while Read's numbers drop.— pillsbury - Reading these post is just hysterical.... I never seen so many arm chair GM's. This is a laugh fest....what a bunch of loons...keep the coming with your absurd assesments of what the Flyers need....LMFAO— fbpdplt
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Broad Street Bull is the Inquirer's blog covering the Philadelphia Flyers and the National Hockey League.
Reach Sam at scarchidi@phillynews.com.
Sam Carchidi
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