Trade of Hunter Pence raises questions about 2013
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Trade of Hunter Pence raises questions about 2013
David Murphy, Daily News Staff Writer
By all accounts, Tommy Joseph is a solid major league prospect. Whether he was solid enough to warrant the trade of Hunter Pence is debatable. What isn't debatable is that the Phillies are not better off for the 2013 season, at least not in terms of talent in right field.
Joseph, the centerpiece of the trade that sent Hunter Pence and cash to the Giants this afternoon, would not appear to factor into the big league picture for next season. Carlos Ruiz will be back, leaving no room at catcher. Besides, Joseph just turned 21 years old. He has power potential, but in his first year at Double-A he has eight home runs with a .260/.313/.391 line in 335 plate appearances. Seth Rosin, a 23-year-old who is currently at Class A, does not project onto the major league roster in 2013, either. Which reduces this deal, from the vantage point of 2013, to Hunter Pence for Nate Schierholtz and some payroll flexibility. Schierholtz is a better defender with an excellent arm, but the Phillies lose about 30 points in on base percentage and plenty of home run power, not to mention the only right-handed power bat in their lineup.
Over the last two seasons, Schierholtz has posted a .271/.326/.429 line with 14 home runs in 558 plate appearances. By comparison, Jimmy Rollins hit .268/.338/.399 with 16 home runs in 631 plate appearances last season.
Pence, on the other hand, hit .289/.357/.486 with 28 home runs in 676 plate appearances during his year in Philadelphia. So in right field, the Phillies take a step back for 2013. Domonic Brown, who was called up today, is not a relevant consideration, since he could have moved into left field even if Pence had remained with the team.
The relevant factor is payroll flexibility. The Phillies likely would have had to pay Pence between $14 million and $15 million next season. Now, they can theoretically spend that money at one of their two obvious vacancies: center field and third base. The third base market is not pretty -- Kevin Youkilis and Mark Reynolds are the top two options available. Center field offers Michael Bourn, Melky Cabrera, and Shane Victorino.
But strictly in terms of talent, the Phillies do not figure to be as good in right field in 2013 as they would have been had they held onto Pence.
We need to be patient. This team will not be a contender for the next few years. But it can make progress. We got some prospects who may turn into legitimate major leaguers in a few years. Spend the money on upgrading the scouting, minor league coaching and managing, and general manager positions. We can afford the best talent evaluation and player development guys out there. That's step #1.— altoonaaslan- Amaro's high-water mark was those few minutes on 12.16.09 after he signed Halladay and before he traded Lee. Today he tried to extricate himself from his own feckless wheeling and dealing, and IMO he ended up looking like as big an icompetent fool as Dan O'Dowd, the idiot GM of the Rockies. "Oh BTW Cliff, we really wanted to unload you and still may try, but we expect you to be 'lights out' against Washington tonight. Try to keep the ball in the infield, because I don't think we'll have an outfield for the game, or in the near future."— ijj
- I'm not overly excited about the Schierholtz part of the deal but I agree that he may surprise us. He had a decent 2011 ... 22 doubles that year. I think it's a case of expect little and be pleasantly surprised if he proves otherwise. He's pretty cheap.— s
- Brown, Mayberry, Pierre, Nix and Schierholtz? I would agree, there are no superstars there. Brown has to play a lot the rest of the season. Mayberry is good in CF, without Victorino, the need Pierre at the top of the order, or 2nd, so Schierholtz may be a late inning defensive replacement, and Nix is still your occasional outfielder and primary left handed PH option.— Paul SoTX
- I've been wondering about Pierre. Since he hasn't been traded maybe consider carrying him next year? Yeah, he's old but I like his effort. He sets a good example if nothing else and he manages to get on base. He might be useful to keep around. I was totally against them carrying him in spring training but he really grew on me. — s
- What about speedster Kyle Hudson from Lehigh Valley? He put up decent OBP numbers in the minors the last two years. — jtj06
- I really thought they'd be able to move Blanton.— s
- Pence is a nice player but no need to fall in love with him. This team did not produce this year (injuries and bad breaks were certainly a big culprit) but we all knew we were playing for 2011. So now we have an older team with some pieces but now with more payroll flexibility to trade or sign their way back to the top of the standings.
Next year: LF- Brown, CF - Michael Bourne, RF - Schierholtz/Mayberry, Jr.
3B - who knows? David Wright? :)— BoricuaPhilsFan - Victorino deal was a good one. Pence deal sucked. Pence was overpaid but a right handed hitting power bat is neeed on this team.— rbrogna1
- Pence was an upside to the team -- theoretically. However, on the practical plateau, I think its worth the roll of the dice to obtain or develop a better option. I know nothing about these prospects, but I hope we received comparable talent in return.— DameB
- Look, something had to be done. I think Amaro understands that and will have an entire off season to make his decisions. I highly doubt he goes into 2013 with this outfield. I would expect him to add two pieces to the outfield mix going forward.
Also, anyone else having problems with this website locking up your browser? I have had to restart several times over the last few days. Also, far too many things loading in the background.— MrPhillie - They are not getting David Wright as there is no way the Meh-ts decline his option. The options are either keep Polanco, sign a free agent like Mark Reynolds or Youkillis, or revisit the trade Lee to the Rangers for Olt and others in the offseason, or bring up someone from the minors (Asche?). I don't really see any of the four options as appealing, so it will be really interesting to see how Amaro fixes the problem.
On another note, I have to believe the Manuel is going to be gone after the year. 2013 is the last year of his contract so they would either have to extend him or let him go so he won't be a lame duck manager next year. I think they would let him go and possibly bring up Sandburg for next year.— sjuhawk416 - Almost everyone underperformed, xc Chooch, JP, Cole, Pappy, and maybe Nix and Fontenot. Doc, Ryan, Chase, Polly--maybe you can blame health. Rollins, Vic, Pence, Lee, Qualls, Stutes, and Bastardo just didn't get it done. Maybe after five Division crowns and a WS title they lost their edge. Maybe it was age. Clearly it's time to clean house. Rebuild it and don't give more than 4 yr guaranteed to anyone over 30.— doc35
- Maybe they can have Hamels play all nine positions. Then he'd be worth the money they're paying him.— distant.star
Any thoughts on how does Freddy Galvis fits into the infield scenario? Seems like the kid did ok until he broke his back. I recall a thread awhile back about moving JStroll to 3rd and letting the kid play SS. It worked for Ripkin...— Stoudt
