Our Jim Thome Plan
One way for Phils to use Jim Thome.
Our Jim Thome Plan
Bob Vetrone Jr.
( (David Maialetti)
Now that the Phillies are done with the designated hitter for this season (at least until the World Series), what do they do with Jim Thome?
Thome, whose back prevents him from playing any fielding position, served the Phillies well in nine games as a DH, but has never showed much promise as a pinch-hitter. (He’s 0-for-11 this season, 0-for-his-last-14 dating back to last July, and hitting .214 in his career.)
So we have a plan ... well, at least half a plan.
The Phillies have 44 road games remaining, games in which they will bat before they play the field. Why not put Thome in the starting lineup in the No. 3 slot for those 44 games and then just have a player replace Thome in the field after he bats in the top of the first inning?
At least this way, Thome will know about when his at-bat will come each night — and against which pitcher — and can plan accordingly. No more worrying about when Charlie Manuel’s going to tell him to get ready or eyeing the bullpen to see if the opposing team has a lefty up just to face him.
And maybe, just maybe, one of the first two hitters could get on base and set the table for Big Jim. Even if they don’t, with 608 career home runs, Thome himself is always in scoring position.
Last time we checked, runs scored in the first inning (in which Thome is a career .274 hitter) counted every bit as much as runs scored in later innings.
And Manuel will still be able to pick his PH spots for Thome in home games, when the Phils have to play the field first.
The Phils aren’t back on the road until next Friday in Miami, so maybe in the meantime Thome will turn into Ed Kranepool (who hit .447, 42-for-94, from 1974-77 as a PH).
But if he doesn’t, maybe this is one way to go.
| THOME as PH | |||
| H-AB | Avg. | HR | |
| 2012 | 0- 11 | .000 | 0 |
| Career | 28- 131 | .214 | 4 |
| THOME in FIRST INNING | |||
| H-AB | Avg. | HR | |
| 2012 | 2- 8 | .250 | 0 |
| Career | 278-1016 | .274 | 76 |
| THOME in NO. 3 HOLE | |||
| H-AB | Avg. | HR | |
| 2012 | — | — | — |
| Career | 534-1934 | .276 | 153 |
Comments (53)
Hey Bob! Thanks for being a sport. I have the perfect ending for the story... Don't want to give anything away but: “Niagara Falls! Slowly I turned… step by step… inch by inch… I crept up on the rogue that stole my gal…”— BudSelig_isthenext_MrBurns- "It was a dark and stormy night ... "— BVJR
- that is the STUPIDIST idea i have ever heard of!!! i mean seriously
this is MLB. T
he guy can either play,or he shouldnt be on the team!!Never knew a last place team could afford a designated pinch hitter!!!— flyers11 - Hey Bob!! I'm writing a novel... which do you like better... 'It was the best of times it was the worst of times.' or OR 'Call me Ishmael.' What are your thoughts? I need something original and gripping.— BudSelig_isthenext_MrBurns
- Now that is an original well thought out plan. I have an original idea... it's called the horseless carriage. Basically, it's a carriage that moves itself! Hopefully, no one has thought of it yet. Man am I gonna make some money! I won't even begin to talk about my ink pen that doesn't require an ink well. The ink well is inSIDE the feather! How about this! STEAM POWER!! Bet no one's thought of that!— BudSelig_isthenext_MrBurns
- Maybe Charlie could manage for the first inning, and then be replaced by someone who knew the game, maybe Homer Simpson or Yogi Bear?— LJM
- Maybe Charlie could manage for the first inning, and then be replaced by someone who knew the game, maybe Homer Simpson or Yogi Bear?— LJM
- Your "plan" was recycled from a local radio host. Come clean and admit it! Plagiarism!— socfiend
- I think any baseball lifer would laugh at that. It's basically wasting a roster spot. Which, come to think of it, is what they have with Big Jim right now with no DH (and I do not want a DH in the NL). As others have suggested, best thing to do for Jim and the team is trade him back to the AL and get something for him. Or release him if no one wants to give up something. It's really that simple. Unfortunately.— PhillySubsMac
Comment removed.- Jim Thome was a great player and a real big part of the Phils turn around into a championship team. Unfortunately, time isn't on Jim's side and now is the time to trade him to a AL team ready for a WS run. Why have the guy sitting on the bench with no chance of getting a WS ring? Come on Charlie, do him justice!— walt1
- Finally, someone thinking. It's worth a try. However, it's not in the book. Can't do it because if it doesn't work and it's not in the book, well then that would be a bad thing. Let's comfortably finish in last. By the book.— Relocator
- Here's a plan: just pay him off the remaining part of the $1 mil contract (approx. $560,000) and make room on the 25-man roster for a productive player. When they signed him in the offseason it seemed that giving one of Cholly's old plas from Cleveland was a kuxury we could afford. Now, reality says "Cut him loose".— 1republican
- The problem with this idea is that now the Phillies would have no power threat late in a game if they need it. Like Charlie used to say about Matt Stairs, even when he was struggling in a PH role....."There's always a chance he can run into one by accident". That's the same for Thome. If you're 3 runs behind in the 9th inning and you've got 2 runners on base and 2 outs...who would you rather have pinch hitting....Thome or Fontenot?— SteveS11
- Duh...I never thought of just calling Thome the pitcher. That makes even more sense assuming the rule doesn't state he has to pitch.— keninVB
- Actually, it would make more sense to bat an unscheduled SP to start the game in the 9 hole. Then you don't lose the bullpen arm. In the bottom of the inning, the real SP replaces Thome in the 3 hole and any starting position player can replace the fake SP in the 9 spot.— keninVB
- I like it!— frankenslade
- You don't need to burn a 2d pitcher. If you decide to bat your pitcher 12 you can call Thome your pitcher for the top of the first and have an order, e.g. of Rollins/Pierre/Thome/Pence/Ruiz/Victorino/Wiggy/Polanco/Martinez. However, I still prefer keeping Victorino out & having him pinch-run.— princeton22
- Gene Mauch used to do this back in the 1960's and I believe that they then passed a rule that you had to play defense in the first inning if you were in the starting lineup.— tomficara
- They did something like that in the mid 70s with Tony Oliva of the Twins. He was a DH but his knees were so shot, that if he got on base, they ahd to pinch run for him. But that worked partly because teams carried, 10, sometimes even 9 or 8 pirchers, so you had more position players/batters. It actually would fit my plan of having 27 or 28-man ropsters with 2 or 3 inactives each game. But hey, it's an interesting idea. As for La Russa, I enjoyed when him when I lived in the Sf Bay area for 20 yrs, but I've grown tired of him so sorta glad he's gone. But he did a thing in the late 90s when the A's stunk that the Rockies are sorta doing. He started a pitcher for only the 3 innings, then brought someone else in for 3 innings, etc. It didn't work well or last long. As for Thome, send him down to AAA to play/coach til the rosters expand ... or trade him to the AL ... or teach him to pay 3rd base!!!— Horst Muhlman lives on in all of us
- clueless Chollie always always follows his 'formula' for using pinch hitters and relivers which entails always saving his "better" pinch hitters and releivers (or those whom he considers better) for later in the game regardless of the situation --thus has Chollie kept his best bat on bench wiht game on line in 7th inning (letting Bruntlett or some other scrub hitting .180 hit with bases loaded if it wasn't yet 8th inning), or bringing in Herndon, Schwimmer, or some other garbage to blow game with bases loaded if it isn't yet 'late enough' to use his better reliever...indeed since I always knwo who Chollie is gonna use, the opposing manager pretty much nows it as well.. he's much too strategically=challenged to figure out how to get the most out of bench and bullpen-- or to even understand it— warbiscuit
- On that same starting lineup, you cold put your worst relief pitcher in the 9th spot. Then when the team takes the field, you can double switch Thome for your real starting pitcher. Then it would take 12 batting spots to get to the pitcher's spot in the order instead of 9. The question is, is it worth it to sacrifice a guy like Schwimer so your real pitcher can bat #12 instead of #9. I say yes.— keninVB
- would be very interesting to say the least..... but I think Charlie would have a stroke if the plan worked.... I could see it working and if big Jims back feels ok then let him play tyhe filed for an inning or so maybe get lucky and get too at bats out of him before making the switch....well that might be wish full thinking... but you never know....— srcdaddy1216
- keystonedave - point well taken. If he can be moved to the Indians it would be a good place for him to end his career. I wouldn't expect much back in return though.— FishFryFrank
- As Arnold would say:" Do it NOW!"— dwp66
- If Thome comes out after the first inning, his position is irrelevant. You could have an initial lineup of Rollins/Pierre/Thome/Pence/Ruiz/Wigginton/Polanco/Martinez/pitcher, with Thome in CF. If one of the first 2 batters manages to get on, even a single from Thome puts you in a good position -- you pinch run Victorino giving you good speed on the bases with your 2 RBI leaders coming up.— princeton22
- We had no idea Missanelli brought this up the other day ... It's just goes to show great minds think alike.
— BVJR - Good idea but in 1 game out of every 3 or 4, against right-handed starting pitching, I'd see if Thome can't play an inning or two in the field and bat a second time. That way, opposing managers can't game plan with as much certainty.— eman
- Trade him to an AL team for a guy who can pitch the 7th inning.
Heck trade him for a prospect.— blah - I'd much rather tell him to go in the field and just stand there, literally, on the bag and catch throws. That's it.— Realistic One
- I love the idea if for no other reason than watching Jim Eisenreich's idea take wings.— Deward
- Yes you did steal that idea for someone several weeks back but it would't hurt to try it.Time to get rid of manuel and bring up Ryne.Sign Cole.Phils are not done yet!— philsfansince1946
- Great idea...completely stolen from Mike Missanelli's show the other day...an idea that Missanelli readily admitted he stole from a listener— beagle29
- Comment removed.
- What, no mention of Mike Missanelli? You did lift his idea right from his program...— dscott
- Dumb idea. I'd at least use him as a pinch hitter almost every game especially vs a RHP. I think they should have him play first base again. He got hurt running the bases, not fielding. Last time I checked, running the bases occurs most when a player is batting. This situation is a great example of the Phillies' and Manuel's flawed logic. They talk themselves into a flawed position based on their own personal biases. This flawed logic also applies to using Papelbon and why Rollins is still batting leadoff and a few other situations.— AvoidSundanceVacations
- except whoever replaced him will have to bat 3rd the rest of the game. one would think a player of this caliber would already be a starter. good idea, but best plan is trade him to AL team and get 1-2 offensive type prospects.— cheesesteak17
The way things are going for the Phils, the day Chollie decides to do that will be the day the game goes 15 innings and the bench is too short. Agree, not very practical. But we should still hold on to him so he can DH for us in the World Series this year.— jp8899- Why not just admit that signing Thome was a good PR move, worth a shot for nostalgia's sake, but ultimately a mistake? If he can't play the field to stay sharp at the plate, and he can't pinch hit worth a darn in the NL, why not do him and the team a favor and trade him for a prospect to an AL team where he can thrive and we can fill a roster spot with a player who can actually take the field if required? I'm sure it's great to have him in the clubhouse, but isn't he suffering too knowing that he could be much more productive in an AL setting? I think it's time to declare the "Thome-in-Philly Era" officially over.— Steve Landis
- I like the idea...Thome is a gamer and would give his best effort toward a idea like that...(I could see multiple 3-run HR's in many 1st innings, as long as we don't give the usual pop-ups at the 1st pitch). Now, trading Thome to AL for the best we can get (farm prospects), I'm just not all in..I see Thome going out as a Phil we eat the money and keep him around— pibby
- That's so crazy, it just might work!— willthethrill11
- Um, so who will replace him in the field and hit in the 3 hole from then on? You're not going to want a scrub like Michael Martinez hitting third the rest of the game, or you'd be taking out someone like Hunter Pence. Doesn't work.— hiphop_JORGE
- very interesting idea, but my guess is that Thome, like most hitters, needs more than one AB a game to stay sharp. I'd trade him to the AL and try to get back as much as the market will bear. That might be the two best prospects in an organization's farm system.— camdenlawprof
- Charlie would never do something that takes creativity, your last chance to implement something like that was when LaRussa was still in the game.— drbob1
- I love it; but I can just imagine Charlie thinking "That does not compute! That does not compute!"— rjw817
- This is the dumbest Idea I have ever seen. Trade Thome today to an American League team and get whatever you can. His value will never be higher than it is right now and he is now useless to the Phils.— FetchDixon
- Comment removed.
- Isn't Howard coming back after the all star game? Haven't heard much about Howard recently?— bobcitydoc
- Great idea and yes, runs in the first are just as important as runs later. In fact, you could make the argument that they are better ...giving your pitcher a lead, especially in a foreign stadium. As for losing a power bat in a late inning situation ... if he's not sucessful doing that (and there is more than a small sample size that says he's not, why kid yourself into thinking he'll always come through. And he'll face something other than lefties.
But, egos do come into play here and it would be hard for ANY manager to make a big change like this at the suggestion of someone outside the club. Pardone me on this but especially from a sports reporter.— nc_bg - I like the idea, but it is at best making lemonade out of a lemon, and at worst it underscores how mismatched Thome is here, even though he is one of the msost loved Phils ever. Thome is at the end, taking a victory lap. He's now a DH not a PH. Out of respect, assuming Thome would agree, Amaro should let him continue his encore lap with Cleveland, which needs a DH while Travis Hafner is DLed. I hope Amaro soon has the mindset of a seller who recognizes that, if he can sign Hamels, he does not need to back up the truck, but he had better begin getting some position prospects in the minors who can do more than pitch. It is time to retooling for next year. Maybe Charlie will need to use your idea for Utley.— keystonedave
- And every time they need a PH later in the same game, or god forbid, go to extra innings, people will never let Charlie hear the end of it. It's creative but not the most practical.— T-Money
- Really good idea. Unfortunately, the mess will be too difficult to clean up after Manuel's brain explodes trying to implement this strategy.— JimEisenreich
- interesting, but Charlie would never waste his security blanket that early.— phils_tnj1
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