This is what gun sanity looks like
This is what gun sanity looks like
Gun sanity looks like this:
Gov. Rick Snyder vetoed a bill this afternoon that would have allowed gun owners with extra training to carry their concealed weapons in schools, day care centers, churches and stadiums.
Gun sanity looks like this:
The Dick's Sporting Goods chain said Tuesday that it is suspending sales of some rifles nationwide because of the Sandy Hook Elementary School shootings.
Gun sanity looks like this:
Perhaps it is not a surprise that Cerberus quickly decided to sell the Freedom Group, its collection of gun companies, including Bushmaster, the firm that made one of the weapons used in the Newtown, Conn., massacre. Cerberus has been notoriously secretive about its finances, and the adverse press it has attracted in the aftermath of Newtown forced a hasty retreat. This should be very encouraging to those of us who wish to shift the debate about guns: A few critical articles, some whispers from major investors questioning their investment in Cerberus, and decisions were instantly made that could cost the company hundreds of millions of dollars.
Four days ago, a horrible tragedy took place. Like any tragedy, iy was also a test of the national spirit. What is happening now is truly remarkable.
Comments (74)
more gun free zones then. lol.— rysagr- Most normal Americans are angry. You on the other hand just keep on laughing about the slaughter of 20 first graders and their teachers. It's really creepy. — one_eyed_jack
- So I guess the wishful thinking is: "I signed this piece of paper, now suicidal psychopaths, hell bent on killing will have to obey the rules."
What makes anyone think they care about rules and proclamations? What makes anyone think someone out to kill will not be able to get a weapon the same way a cocaine addict gets cocaine, or a drunk gets behind the wheel of his car? It's all banned, yet it happens everyday.— jmc - No, this is what the beginnings of a DICTATORSHIP look like- based on a GROUNDLESS FEAR HYPED BY A COMPLICIT MEDIA. This is stupidity based on the liberal love of disarmament. How do you guys like your victims? DISARMED? Bunch of morons who will wonder WHAT HAPPENED when they find their Freedom has GONE AWAY through their own hubris and failure to comprehend what they were doing. All in the interest of a little false safety.— ng19delta
- The "false safety" is thinking that your kids are any safer if everyone around them were carrying assault rifles.
- So "freedom" is 26 people being killed in an elementary school by some nut?
That kind of freesom you can keep.— carl and sons - Truly remarkable? When do the criminals disarm you dolt?— georgel
- seems those on the left love dead kids. exactly how is a law keeping people with permits out of schools going to keep kids safer. how exactly????— rysagr
- I'm not sure there is anything remarkable about an investment firm moving to a more secure financial position in light of a tragedy complete with a media feeding frenzy. While I do not agree with the tone of some of the prior posts, the point that steps like this would have zero impact on preventing what happened in Newton is certainly valid. Is this no more than an act of contrition akin to someone wearing black for a year when a loved one dies. It's doing something, but nothing to address or prevent a future similar circumstance.— elbrewador
Comment removed.- when will Bunch express his outrage over Obama & Holder sending thousands of guns south of the border in a program deliberately designed to result in murder & mayhem on an unprecendented scale? literally hundreds of dead already with many more to come. and yet he'll post hundreds of blog posts over many years about 3 guys getting some water sprinkled on their faces? what. a. fraud. #socalledreporter #whatmediabias— teardownthisfishwrap
- Maybe when you start expressing your outrage about the 100,000 Iraqi civilians killed by Bush & Co. with their "shock & awe" nonsense.
Selective outrage stinks, huh?— carl and sons 
Has to start somewhere! May be slow to start off with, but by keeping the ball rollong towards removing the forks from those that wish to do harm to others. This is a good start!!!— gibby58- I guess Will doesn't know the difference between "suspended", and "stopped".— LouDiamondPhillipsheadScrewdriver
- This comment has been deleted.— Hooray Diversity!
- I think of Ben stating that to all the politicians afraid of crossing the NRA.
- This comment has been deleted. — Hooray Diversity!
- It never gets old reading posts from low-information conservatives, who take a random quote from Thomas Jefferson or Benjamin Frankin and apply it to something these men could noy have conceived of in 2012.
— wokmaster - The members of the Obstructionist Party has decided, once again, not to get on board with the rest of Planet Earth. If 20 dead 6 and 7 year-olds doesn't give these people cognitive dissonance concerning a creepy worsip of firearms, nothing will.— wokmaster
- No one is saying you can't defend yourself, just that you can't own a munitions dump and a stockpile of military weapons. People are not willing to see people murdered just to assuage your paranoia. Gun worship is a symptom of the mental illness we should be talking about.— carl and sons
- "Only fools give up their right to defend themselves." . . . . And their right to protect their children for the political safety of an NRA rating.— montani semper liberi
- Cerberus is the name of the dog that guards the gates of hell- a wonderfully apt name for a manufacturer of assault weapons.— carl and sons
- One of the ironies of the right-wing seeking sanctuary in the 2nd Amendment is how Jefferson deemed it insurance against the need for a standing army. Are they willing to disband our national armed forces and require every adult male to keep and bear a modern "musket" in accordance with each state governor's regulations, and attend militia duty, as Jefferson envisioned?— montani semper liberi
- I love the way people try to find profound quotes to back up their positions, particularly when those quote are meaningless because they back both sides of the argument! Winston Churchill once said nearly the same thing as Franklin about the Munich pact (when England and France tried to "appease" Germany). Little did he know how those words would slap him in the face years later when he opposed the war crimes trial of German Field Marshall Manstein and even contributed money for his defense. He even tried to insist that the German generals acted with chivalry and gallantry. The reason was priceless: Churchill feared the German opposition to the trial would disrupt allowing Germany's ability to participate in NATO (that temporary security thingy), as if the Germans would have surrendered to the Soviets just because some old general was put on trial!— SteveMG
- Here's the amazing part of the bill Snyder had to veto:
"In his veto letter sent to the Legislature shortly before 4 p.m., Snyder said the bill had a fatal loophole that didn’t allow for those institutions to opt out of the new legislation and prohibit weapons from their buildings."
It FORCED schools and daycare centers to allow gun-totting yahoos into their buildings! Oh, and stadiums. Football stadiums included (there are never any hotheads guzzling beer and starting fights there!) That's the kind of loonies we are up against.— Hamlet - Why are you in favor of limiting the rights of law abiding gun owners to bring assault weapons in a school? You must be a commie.
Seriously, didn't someplace pass a law saying that bar owners couldn't keep people from bringing weapons into their establishments?
I think that brainwashed, paranoid cult members tend to see things a little differently from sane people.— carl and sons - I've said it before, and it's still as true as ever: These right wingers would have been loyalists in the 1770s. They would have wanted their guns to protect themselves from those lefties like Jefferson, Adams, Franklin (and all his secular "science").— SteveMG
- Walmart sez: "Cheap Bushmasters for everyone!" and the NRA sez: "Let's pass laws that allow them into schools and daycare centers!"
>>>>"In a statement, Wal-Mart, another retailer that sells guns at its stores, said it had made "no change to the assortment of guns" it sells, but that it has removed an informational page about the Bushmaster .223 rifle on its website, but that it remains "dedicated to the safe and responsible sale of firearms."<<<<
Removed the ads from their web site but still sells them. Despicable!— Hamlet - The only responsibilty Walmart has is to the almighty $$$. — carl and sons
- Sanity? Do you consider "sanity" the overt emotional overreaction to a tragedy? Do you consider "sanity" for people to renounce their constitutional rights in exchange for an illusion of safety? Are you advocating for a "sanity" clause to be appended to the Bill of Rights?
Sorry, Virginia, there is no sanity clause!— DonQ - Hooray for Chico Marx!
How about the tragedy before that, and the one before that and the one before that and the one before that? Not to mention the next one. When does it stop being "overemotional" and start being a rational concern? For some people, apparently never.
Restricting types and numbers of guns is not abrogating a constitutional right. You are still allowed to bear arms and defend yourself, just not some types of arms. Just like you can't legally slander or libel someone.— carl and sons - I'm actually surprised that Bunch even brought up Dicks and Cerberus.
Two non-government groups taking action is the complete opposite of what he wants to see happen. The end result may be the same, but it doesn't really work well with his narrative of how only the government can solve our problems.— barlowjames1 - Its sad that it took an event like a massacre of 6 year old children to get people to realize assult weapons and the like should not be available. Its even sadder that some people still don't get it. And this is coming from someone who can't stand will and is probably called a "right-wing-looney" by the lefties on here.
You can defend your home and family with ONE six round revolver. You can go hunting with ONE single round riffle. Anything more than this is a tool of war, and has no place in the hands of civilians, even well trained and responsible civilians don't need weapons of war.— Greg S - It turns out the 2nd Amendment was the compromise between the idealists like Jefferson and other constitutional delegates who resisted his desired ban in the Constitution on standing armies. Jefferson wrote to a friend in 1788, "With respect to the new Government, nine or ten States will probably have accepted by the end of this month. The others may oppose it. Virginia, I think, will be of this number. Besides other objections of less moment, she will insist on annexing a bill of rights to the new Constitution, i. e. a bill wherein the Government shall declare that, 1. Religion shall be free; 2. Printing presses free; 3. Trials by jury preserved in all cases; 4. No monopolies in commerce; 5. No standing army. Upon receiving this bill of rights, she will probably depart from her other objections" Note the lack of any compelling right to keep and bear arms in Virginia's demands.— montani semper liberi
- Something I'm curious about. When Benghazi happened, people on here complained that Republicans were trying to politicize that tragedy. Why isn't the same being said here?— LouDiamondPhillipsheadScrewdriver
- You didn't stop politicizing Bengahzi just because someone complained, did you?
- Yeah, Greg, and I have read that a majority of NRA *members* (not the organization, it's over the top) believe in sensible gun laws, too. You don't have to be a liberal to have basic common sense.— Hamlet
- I'd like to believe that, but I won't until they stop sending in dues and start cancelling their memberships. If a group does not truly represent your beliefs, it may be time to rethink your association with that group. — carl and sons
- "You didn't stop politicizing Bengahzi just because someone complained, did you?"
MSL, you haven't figured out yet that wingnuts are mega p*$$ies? They need to be armed everywhere they go because if someone looks at them wrong they wet themselves, and if someone of higher intelligence rebuts an argument of theirs then they are being persecuted. Can you imagine what it must be like to live in that kind of fear and shame?— Hamlet - "Two non-government groups taking action is the complete opposite of what he wants to see happen" . . . . . Actually its the complete opposite of what the NRA wants to see happen. The NRA depends heavily these days on the corporate sponsorships, endowments, and lobbying support it gets from the gun industry. One major ammo and high-capacity magazine dealer even donates the NRA a portion of each sale rounded up to the dollar, as a sales promotion.
- "Are you advocating for a "sanity" clause to be appended to the Bill of Rights?" . . . . . . I thought Oliver Wendell Holmes settled that argument in 1919. Sanity is implicit in the Constitution lest you want to protect someone falsely shouting "fire" in a crowded theater.
- "Seriously, didn't someplace pass a law saying that bar owners couldn't keep people from bringing weapons into their establishments?" . . Even those laws have enough sense to leave it up to the proprieter, or prohibit the gun bearer from drinking.
- One of the elements of Constitutional "liberty" is the right to travel, yet I don't see car manufacturers lobbying Congress or the states to lift driver licensing requirements or vehicle registration, speed limits or carpooling lanes. Some of us might feel safer on modern highways if only allowed our god-given right to drive an M1 Abrams tank to work. What about a commuter's right to self-defense, eh?
- "That kind of freesom you can keep." — carl and sons
Unfortunately, that is the most un-American comment I have ever read. Sad your public education didn't teach enough American history so you understand what the USA stands.— Fisher - for?
So the United States stands for a crazy person shooting up an elementary school?
That's a strange thing for a country to stand for.— carl and sons - Quiet everyone! Fisher is going to tell us what the USA stands for. Fisher?— Hamlet
- LOL! And the reward for the best timed post on a blog goes to...
Hamlet.— carl and sons - Hamlet and carl and sons- you are free to do as you desire. Laws protect us from consequences and set up boundaries, but we have the 'Blessings of Liberty' to be free of tyranny which would make laws or tax (two very popular undertakings by Obama) unless we elect and think wise for now and future generations (currently lost on the left). The fact that carl and sons want us to limit our abilities so much is very un-American, very much restrict our freedoms so we cannot maneuver around the country, we cannot post here, we cannot do or cannot live. Hamlet and Carl and Sons are the fools of society who do not understand they are crimpling themselves by voting for more laws and taxes, not liberating themselves to being greater, having more liberties, or becoming a higher elevated person. Instead they think they are voting to help the poor minded, they are only really helping those who already have the most and eat from the simple crumbs left behind.— Fisher
- Sarah Palin, is that you? — carl and sons
- Okay, now can you please translate what you just said from Idiotese?— Hamlet
- What is needed is a 50% tax on campaign contributions to pay for improved school security. Fewer political ads so everyone is happy. The liberals will do a circle j*rk because there is a new tax and conservatives will burn offerings to Rush because they get good guns into schools.
"if someone of higher intelligence rebuts an argument of theirs"..."The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant: It's just that they know so much that isn't so." The youngling Hamlet confuses intelligence with wisdom.— 2ndNlong - Prohibition has a great track record.— sadim
- As it pertains lawful firearm ownership, prohibition is working so well.
http://articles.philly.com/2012-08-18/news/33249371_1_illegal-firearms-violent-crime-gun-problem— sadim - Hamlet your are voting yourself into tyranny by insisting you need more laws and taxes to live. Thus being a good slave to democratic machine. Is that simple enough for you?
— Fisher - Yeah, Hamlet, why would you follow the famous tyrant who said this: "While we recognize that assault-weapon legislation will not stop all assault-weapon crime, statistics prove that we can dry up the supply of these guns, making them less accessible to criminals"
- This comment has been deleted.— Hooray Diversity!
- I know it's incredibly difficult to tell the difference between a machine whose purpose is to kill a bunch of people, and a machine whose purpose is to transport people and things.
(HINT: The one with the wheels is the transportation one.)— carl and sons - "THIS IS A FACT."http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/07/21/1112405/-Gun-Deaths-by-State-and-Other-FindingsIt is? Please cite this fact with valid data proving it. Because if you look at the gun death rates by state, the states with the least restrictive gun laws (Arizona, Mississippi, Louisiana, Arkansas, et al.) also have the have the highest gun death rates. So please show me facts that prove otherwise.What's equally interesting is that states with higher college graduation rates and creative class jobs have fewer gun deaths.And, of course, states with stricter gun control laws have lower gun deaths. (HTML deleted)
— Mr_Cool - The only truly repugnant move towards tyranny the past 20 years was the Patriot Act, and most people on the right, with the exception of hardcore Libertarians, didn't hardly make a peep. The left, of course, opposed it vehemently.
Personally, I feel guns have been romanticized far beyond their true rational utility. The right-wing attachment to guns is not only creepy, it is irrational beyond any reasonable measure. The odds these millions of gun owners will ever need to use their weapons is greater than the chance they will die in a plane crash.
I think most goobers building huge personal arsenals out there are much like Travis Bickle in "Taxi Driver," creepy sociopaths with delusional fantasy lives where they, gun in hand, will "save" everyone from the boogeymen they imagine are surrounding us and preparing to attack us at any moment. Their puerile and distorted worldview is only trumped by their sociopathic paranoia and misanthropy.
How exactly are we living free in a society where everyone is armed? How do we distinguish between tyrants and friends in such a society? Who do we trust? How do we feel about armed and unelected/unappointed vigilantes who, unlike cops and soldiers, do not swear and affirm oaths to defend the constitution and abide by a uniform code of conduct while armed?
They should be disarmed.— Mr_Cool - 1. — carl and sons
- But, but..didn't you see Red Dawn?? We could be attacked at any moment, even by our own govt! It's so scary!
— one_eyed_jack - The National Defense Authorization Act expands the overreach of the Patriot Act, and that was signed in the last year or so. I vehemently oppose it.
The characterization that all people building huge arsenals are goobers discounts and/or minimizes the people who have a catalog of firearms for recreational purposes and understand and abide by the law and by gun safety standards. While that recreation may not be 'the cup of tea' of many people, why should their rights be taken away? What are they doing wrong? Are they less worthy of the civil liberties the constitution grants them? Why advocate for managing to the exception?
Your last paragraph summarizes AMC's The Walking Dead.— sadim - 96.356% of statistics by right wingers are never backed up with facts (even when specifically asked). Of course I may be off by .02% or so, I'm not sure.— Hamlet
- Mr Cool - Speaking of romanticizing, could you ever have imagined that one day you'd be romanticizing the Grand Old Party from yesteryear? Ya know, the one which believed in coming together during economic catastrophies and senseless killings due to lax firearm laws? Me either. Seems like somewhere along the line the Republican Party became subsumed by the Tea Party - not the other way around. To think any sensible American could take seriously guys like Georgel, rysgar or a goon with the handle of "Hooray Diversity!"... *sigh*
But hey, the initials still work for this group of goobers: Greed. Obstruction. Paranoia. Those 3 words sum up the ideology of the party opposite.
GregS - Thank you for your rational comments on this issue. Believe me, you and I might disagree in the future, but I atleast know you're sane. Puts you in a rare category on this blog (General Turg comes to mind). Life is short. In the case of these children, far too short. Something must be done about this unneccasary weaponry. We aren't going to convince any of these goobers with rational debate. Time to leave them and their fantasies of becoming the next Rambo behind. Thanks again, Greg - you have been a breath of fresh air over the last few days.— wokmaster - One thing's for sure, the wall-to-wall 5 days straight hyper coverage of this shooting will pretty much guarantee more of the same. Congratulations to you & your profession Bunch. Oh, and President Phony Tears using the tragedy to raise campaign funds & push tax hikes is about as classless as it gets.— teardownthisfishwrap
- Hamlet - I wish these people ONLY made up statistics.
To bolster his case that more armed people will prevent these tragdies, the creep who likes to call himself a "professor" keeps saying that the Oregon Mall shooter was stopped by an armed civilian. He also says in every related post that the "media is covering the story up".
This is a blatant lie on both counts. First of all, there is not one shred of evidence or witness testimony about an armed civilian engaging the shooter. None.
Secondly - the shooter's firearm jammed, which along with local police and mall security performing joint exercises in case of this type of situation, prevented the casualty count from being higher.
Lastly, the killer took his own life.
Nevertheless, "professor" copied and pasted his rant on multiple threads.— wokmaster - I know. I've seen the posts. I've called him on so many lies in the past that I just got tired of doing it so I ignored that one. Does a work of truth ever (accidentally) leak out from his keyboard? — Hamlet
- If a group does not truly represent your beliefs, it may be time to rethink your association with that group.
You mean like a labor union, Carl?— philly2flag - Are you recieving salary and benefits negotiated by that union. If so, then they represent your interests, if not your political beliefs. — carl and sons
- Funny thing is, other countries, namely Australia and Canada, have dealt with gun massacres by enacting laws that restrict access to guns. But then they are countries who ignore their lunatics unlike the good old USA which in some cases elects them to office. The funny part is that since these laws have been enacted, multiple mass shootings have not occurred in either country (Australia had 13 in the period prior to the 1996 law, 0 after). As far as I can tell neither country has devolved into tyranny as a direct correlation to reduced gun ownership. Instead of guns, the Red Dawn types should invest in brown camoflage underwear because they appear to be afraid of alot of things, the government, people with more melanin in their skin, Kenyans, Sharia Law, FEMA...— abendteuer
- This is what companies who don't want to be on the wrong end of the Imperial President's executive orders look like.— operagost
- Ah, when it's your first grader riddled with a bullet or two let us know how you feel then.— Tkat
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