....or Rudy Giuliani, or something like that.
Seriously, I'm trying to get my arms around this new story on the Blagojevich scandal that the New York Times has put out there. The lede of the article is tantalizing:
In a sequence of events that neatly captures the contradictions of Barack Obama’s rise through Illinois politics, a phone call he made three months ago to urge passage of a state ethics bill indirectly contributed to the downfall of a fellow Democrat he twice supported, Gov. Rod R. Blagojevich.
Mr. Obama placed the call to his political mentor, Emil Jones Jr., president of the Illinois Senate. Mr. Jones was a critic of the legislation, which sought to curb the influence of money in politics, as was Mr. Blagojevich, who had vetoed it. But after the call from Mr. Obama, the Senate overrode the veto, prompting the governor to press state contractors for campaign contributions before the law’s restrictions could take effect on Jan. 1, prosecutors say.
OK, so what I'm getting from that is that Barack Obama supports ethics in government, that he doesn't think state contractors should be making large campaign contributions. Hey, that's a good thing, right?Right?
Uh, according to the New York Times, not necessarily:
Beyond the irony of its outcome, Mr. Obama’s unusual decision to inject himself into a statewide issue during the height of his presidential campaign was a reminder that despite his historic ascendancy to the White House, he has never quite escaped the murky and insular world of Illinois politics. It is a world he has long navigated, to the consternation of his critics, by engaging in a kind of realpolitik, Chicago-style, which allowed him to draw strength from his relationships with important players without becoming compromised by their many weaknesses.
"Beyond the irony of its outcome..."? Huh? How about...beyond the irony of the fact that an Obama phone call for an ethics reform bill -- strongly opposed by none other than Rod Blagojevich -- is an excuse to somehow tie him to the "murky" world of Chicago politics. Look (as Obama himself might say), there's some interesting new information in this Times article, but their basic perspective is all upside-down wrong.
Did it occur to them that maybe Obama was elected 44th president of the United States exactly because he HAS escaped "the murky and insular world of Illinois politics"? When people ask why would someone like Obama involve himself in Chicago politics, the bottom line is Chicago is where he lived -- he moved there to organize laid-off steelworkers, got a job there and then even married a Windy City native.
Most people run for office in THE CITY WHERE THEY LIVE -- that caused Obama to cross paths with an interesting cast of characters, but in the case of Rod Blagojevich, it seems like once he took the measure of the man he didn't want much to do with him. He had little to do with Blago after 2006, didn't even ask him to speak at the Dem convention in 2008, and his people didn't give the governor the time of day regarding his recent Senate machinations. Obama mostly kept their "murky" world at arm's length, which is a reason why he is president-elect and why the notion that a machine hack like Blagojevich could even think about running for president in 2016 is almost proof of his insanity.
But this Times story is Day One of what is going to be a brand new silly season in American politics, just when you thought it was safe. No matter how much the next few days demonstrate that Obama didn't want any part of Blago's scam, every phone call in which a junior staffer didn't immediately hang up, or any time that Obama and Blagojevich were in the same room and Obama didn't slap a pair of cuffs on the governor will be more proof of the "murky" circles that Obama travels in.
Wait until they found out that Obama's set foot in Philadelphia, too.
Posted by Will Bunch @ 10:37 PM
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73 comments
President Bush should pardon Blagojevich, so he can continue to muck things up for Obama. Moreover, President Bush should pardon Obama for his campaign contribution fraud and for his yet-to-be investigated quid-pro-quos with the corrupt Tony Rezko......
The Presidential Pardon can be a fun toy to play with.
TYpical of all the rightie yahoos that they will try to pin something on Obama when all evidence points to the contrary. Like Rahm Emmanuel turning in the governor. Like the phone call mentioned above. Like blagojevich admitting on tape that Obama wasn't helping, that the US attorney Patrick Fitzgerald, whom Rove tried to get fired, admitting that Obama had no involvement whatsoever. Righties never let truth get in the way of their crying (see: Irag-wmds, etc).
TYpical of all the rightie yahoos that they will try to pin something on Obama when all evidence points to the contrary. Like Rahm Emmanuel turning in the governor. Like the phone call mentioned above. Like blagojevich admitting on tape that Obama wasn't helping, that the US attorney Patrick Fitzgerald, whom Rove tried to get fired, admitting that Obama had no involvement whatsoever. Righties never let truth get in the way of their crying (see: Irag-wmds, etc).
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Barack Obama, the billion dollar candidate, supports an ethics reform bill designed to curb the influence of money in politics?
"In a sequence of events that neatly captures the contradictions of Barack Obama’s rise through Illinois politics, a phone call he made three months ago to urge passage of a state ethics bill indirectly contributed to the downfall of a fellow Democrat he twice supported, Gov. Rod R. Blagojevich." Never mind that Obama helped block Illinois ethics reform prior to that call. "Did it occur to them that maybe Obama was elected 44th president of the United States exactly because he HAS escaped "the murky and insular world of Illinois politics"? " Yah, sure, Will. His fundraising brought in millions in untraceable small donations. He lied about his level of association with Ayers, he lied about his knowledge of Wright, and now aides are 'correcting' a statement by Axelrod that he had talked to Blag-o-Crook. Obama didn't escape jack, Will - he just merged Chicago politics with Little Rock politics, and we'll get the worst of both. But go ahead, keep waving those Obama-poms as you downplay missteps by the Messiah. After all, hard-nosed reporting is only to be applied to GOP presidents.
Hmmm Blago is Repub, right? Fitz only goes after Repubs and his cases are flimsy on hard evidence, right?!. And only a repub is as corrupt as Blago - he's gotta be a repub!!!! Please media, stop putting that "D" after his name!!!
Corruption in politics is not a right or left thing. For every D there's an R and vice versa. Didn't I read that Rezko was Blago's bag man? And Obama had ties to Rezko? So I don't think the suggestion in the article the the politics in Chi-town be a little murky was that far off base. But JMC, just because someone can raise a lot of money, doesn't mean they can't support limitations on where donations come from. That kind of linear thinking won't get you anywhere.
"He lied about his level of association with Ayers"...--}}} lol! Lemmed guess, db - you're gonna trot out the "launched his career in Ayers' living room canard once again? Still smarting that your new-found loves and heroic crusading reformers, McCain and Palin, got shot down by the American public, eh? Oh, right, I forgot, the only reason that happened was because of the vast left-wing media conspiracy. My bad. Obama is certainly nor more corrupted than the bloke we've had for the past eight years. The bloke you voted for twice. And the upside is that Obama appears not to be an idiot, and he will help pull the country out of the economic and foreign policy mess your boy got us into. Chin up, db. Holding all that bitterness inside is bad for your health.
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Even if there were evidence that Obama was involved, the media would protect him. I'm suprised President Bush hasn't been blamed yet. It is his fault that it is raining today isn't it? BTW, this is the same same Patrick Fitzgerald that kept the Valerie Plame investigation going for 2 1/2 years AFTER he he knew who leaked her name just so he could a process crime. Why shut this down so soon when they knew everytime Blago breathed with the bugs they had in place? Who were they trying to protect? Curious to say the least.
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You guys are hilarious. Really. No connections whatsoever, in fact evidence to the contrary, yet you continue to insist that it exists. Sorta like how you insisted that there were deeper connections to ayers that the librul media was ignoring. Obama Derangment Syndrome is in full effect, and he hasn't even started two wars or doubled the debt yet.
There we go, folks. "The media" "The media" is responsible for Bush being a complete failure in every respect. "The media" is responsible for fooling the majority of voters into thinking that after 8 years of failure, a McCain/Palin ticket was a loser. "The media" is going to hide anything negative about Obama, and by the way, anything negative you can imagine about Obama is, in fact, true. I'm thinking I may have to bwaaaack these guys.
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""The media" is going to hide anything negative about Obama, and by the way, anything negative you can imagine about Obama is, in fact, true." Anyone else notice that most of the people complaining about media bias are also the ones who trot out numbers showing how Fox's ratings are superior and that liberal rags are on the outs? If no one is watching or reading the librul media, how are they fooling so many people? How do they reconcile this clear contradiction?
Xi Jah - interesting description of the media. However, I believe you stole that image from the one of you and your fellow travelers with Bush and Chaney standing over all of you!
So much for Obama's claim that he hasn't discussed the matter of his replacement with Blag-O-crook:
http://www.connecttristates.com/news/news_story.aspx?id=217582
Who will fill Obama's senate seat?
Ill. governor meeting with Obama today
By Carol Sowers
Wednesday, November 05, 2008 at 10:39 a.m.
CHICAGO, ILL. -- Now that Barack Obama will be moving to the White House, his seat in the U.S. Senate representing Illinois will have to be filled.
That's one of Obama's first priorities today.
He's meeting with Governor Rod Blagojevich this afternoon in Chicago to discuss it.
"Lemmed guess, db - you're gonna trot out the "launched his career in Ayers' living room canard once again? " Ayers himself said in his recent NY Times interview that Obama was a family friend, something Obama omitted. Do try to keep up with the dribbiling out of the truth now that the election is over, TPD.
"How do they reconcile this clear contradiction?.." Lol! What makes you think they can understand the contradiction, let alone that they have the integrity to reconcile contradictions when they are apparent in what they say? How about these contradictions with their vast left-wing media conspiracy: they claim that "libz" hate America and are elitists - yet over and over our Republican toady buddies display contempt for Americans by accusing Americans of being too stupid to weigh evidence properly. And our Republican toady buddies base their whole world view on the notion that they have some brilliant gift of insight unavailable to the average American. (and I promise, RG, not one of the Attytood Republican toadies will step up to the plate to address those contradictions.)
How did Ayers contexualize the term "family friend," db?
This Blago clown was a well known corrupt figure for quite some time and was tolerated for years by the Chicago/Illinois machine politics. Now that the jig is up they're all running to distance themselves from what they knew was going on for years in the most corrupt corrupt city and state in the country.
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db, past your cute nickname for the IL guv, you offer nothing new. Read the indictment again, Blagovich was on AUDIO TAPE saying that he discussed it ith Obama, but was clearly upset that Obama didn't offer him anything in return. Desperation is a stinky cologne.
"No connections whatsoever, in fact evidence to the contrary, yet you continue to insist that it exists."
Nah, other than the fact that Obama is fibbing about having contact with Blag-o-crook about his Senate replacement. Both Axelrod and a news story I posted earlier contract Obama's claim about having contact with Blag-o-crook. So why is Obama lying yet again about the nature of his associations with others? Quite a pattern is setting up here.
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"How did Ayers contexualize the term "family friend," db?" "Family Friend" is a lot more that "guy from the neighborhood" - but I don't expect Obama defenders to care any longer, just as Obama is lying about not having contact with Blag-o-crook about his replacement - Obama is contradicted by both Axelrod AND a news story.
The media keeps telling me that the Earth is round, but darnit, I just know it's flat!
"And Blagojevich himself, in taped conversations cited by prosecutors, suggested that Obama wouldn't be helpful to him. Even if the governor was to appoint a candidate favored by the Obama team, Blagojevich said, "they're not willing to give me anything except appreciation.""
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28150330/
"db, past your cute nickname for the IL guv, you offer nothing new. Read the indictment again, Blagovich was on AUDIO TAPE saying that he discussed it ith Obama, but was clearly upset that Obama didn't offer him anything in return. " So why is Obama lying about not having any contact with Blag-o-crook about the matter? That's my point - it's a pattern with Obama to downplay and lie about associations. If there is nothing wrong going on, why the lie?
From same article:
"The two Illinois politicians have never been especially close and have largely operated in different Democratic Party camps in the state. Blagojevich's disdain for Obama was clear in court documents; he is quoted as calling the president-elect a vulgar term in one phone conversation recorded by the FBI."
Wrong, db. If you think there is something meaningful about Ayers' statement that Obama was a "family friend," then you need to consider how Ayers contextualizes that comment. The term is fairly ambiguous, and so if you're going to accuse Obama of lying in that he said something different than what Ayers said, you have to determine what Ayers meant by the term family friend. Here is how he contextualized the term: --snip-- "I think my relationship with Obama was probably like thousands of others in Chicago." --snip-- There is nothing about that definition of "family friend" which is inconsistent with what Obama said. Meanwhile, you voted, twice, for someone who downplayed an extensive network of associations with Abramoff. Also, please note that for all their trying, no frightwinger ever provided evidence that when Obama said that he hadn't heard Wright say the things that everyone was so horrified about - he wasn't telling the truth. You and Hannity must have pulled out all the stops to come up with something about that complete irrelevancy also. Give it a rest, db. Move on. Get over it. Go back to lecturing us about what "libz" need to do to win elections. It was far more interesting.
Let's talk about something meaningful, db. Do you have some evidence that Obama was somehow involved in Blagojevich's illegal activities? Do you have some evidence that Obama knew that Blgojevich was conducting illegal activities and didn't notify authorities? If so, please provide it. Otherwise, why don't you focus on explaining how Obama's cabinet/administration appointments support your wild-eyed conspiracy-based statements that Obama is a "Marxist."
Ah, this must be twisting the right's areolas......Blagojevich on tape slamming O, and this is a quote: “because they’re not willing to give me anything except appreciation.”
You missed the point, LJL. Obama is, by deductive reasoning, guilty of anything that you could imagine because the vast left-wing media conspiracy is dedicated to duping the stupid American public. The brilliant Republican toadies are so much smarter than anyone else that they can see through the conspiracy, but they just can't quite put their hands on any actual evidence.
I completely agree with your take, will. Here's the paragraph from the Times article that had me going huh? "Though extreme examples, they were emblematic of the path cut by Mr. Obama through Chicago politics, where he became known for making alliances of convenience with personalities that seemed antithetical to his self-image as a progressive reformer. His political roots were in the left-leaning neighborhood of Hyde Park, but at key moments in his career he did not hesitate to form relationships with politicians who were fixtures of the Democratic machine." So a state senator or US Senator who LEGALLY works with other office holders to get something done is "making alliances of convenience" or refusing to "hesitate to form relationships with politicians who were fixtures of the Democratic machine." Yes, Messers Zeleny and McIntire, it's called governing. It's probably been so many years that we've seen it done successfully that one can be forgiven for not recognizing it and regarding it as foreign and sinister.
"Do you have some evidence that Obama was somehow involved in Blagojevich's illegal activities? "
Why is Obama lying about not meeting with Blag-o-crook over his Senate replacement? That is clearly becoming a pattern of his.
"If you think there is something meaningful about Ayers' statement that Obama was a "family friend," then you need to consider how Ayers contextualizes that comment."
Spin, spin, spin away the lies, TPD.
This is typical city driven Democratic politics. Why is everyone so shocked? Because 25% of the people who voted for Obama had no idea what they were voting for, and the other 25% are hate driven radicals who will vote for any dem no matter what.
"Spin, spin, spin away the lies, TPD...--}}} Lol! First you say that Ayers' statement that they were family friends proves that Obama is a liar. Then you say that how Ayers defines "family friend" (coincidentally, in a way that is consistent with how Obama characterized their relationship) is "spin." C'mon db, you can do better than that. Step up to the plate. How was Obama's statements about their relationship different than what Ayers says he means by the term "family friend?"
"Why is Obama lying about not meeting with Blag-o-crook over his Senate replacement? ..---}}} I take that as an admission that you have absolutely no evidence, eh db? None. Zilch. I'm not sure I'd call it "lying." It could have been a mistaken comment - you know, like Bush's hundreds of comments about Iraq's WMD. But for the sake of argument, let's say it was a lie to try to avoid any misconception about ties to illegal activities. I wouldn't, for a minute, think that Obama is above lying to cover his *ss. He's a politician, and by definition, they all do that. But without evidence of wrong-doing, all you have is a conspiracy theory. It seems that increasingly, that's what you have to bring to the table. Speaking of which, where's your evidence of the great Obama-as-a-Maxist conspiracy?
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Really, this is about what I'd expect. Any evidence that Obama was tied in any way to illegal activities? Nope. In fact, you have clear evidence that Obama REFUSED to deal with someone who is accused of illegal activities. Any you're going to focus, obsessively, on whether there is an inconsistency in Obama's statement about a conversation he had? Seriously, have you become that pathetic? Has your election loses - where you had a campaign based on smearing your opponent on irrelevant issues - taught you nothing? Get to work. Dig up something of significance. It's your only hope for not being even further marginalized. I say that as a friend who cares about you deeply. Namaste.
"Because 25% of the people who voted for Obama had no idea what they were voting for, and the other 25% are hate driven radicals who will vote for any dem no matter what....---}}} There you go. Yet another "patriot" who thinks nothing of smearing the majority of the American voting public.
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b.atkinson, what is this Obama lie about meeting with Blagojevich? Does that refer to Obama's claim that he never discussed his replacement with Blagojevich but Axelrod said a month ago in Fox that they did?
Do an of you have proof that the meeting actually took place? All I've seen is an article from a local paper saying he was scheduled to meet with him.
"That is clearly becoming a pattern of his."
And its clearly becoming a pattern of yours to go into screaming hysterics while overanalyzing simple terms like "family friend" in an attempt to paint Obama as corrupt or a terrorist sympathizer. Sad, really.
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"Do an of you have proof that the meeting actually took place? All I've seen is an article from a local paper saying he was scheduled to meet with him. "That is clearly becoming a pattern of his." And its clearly becoming a pattern of yours to go into screaming hysterics while overanalyzing simple terms like "family friend" in an attempt to paint Obama as corrupt or a terrorist sympathizer."
Except it's all part of a pattern that the Obama pep squad refuses to see. Obama sat the pews for 20 years and never heard Reverend Wright say any of that stuff. Ayers was just a guy in the neighborhood even though Ayers says he was a family friend. Obama never met with Blag-o even though his advisor Axelrod and a news account clearly indicated otherwise. If none of those were a big deal, then why the lies?
"Really, this is about what I'd expect. Any evidence that Obama was tied in any way to illegal activities? Nope" Once again, why the continuous string of lies about his associations? Obama said he never had family friend relations with that radical, Bill Ayers. He never heard any of Wright's bombast in 20 years in the pews. And now this. Of course, y'all defend it even as it turns out Obama lied to his supporters as well about how he would govern if elected. Seems to me y'all should be the ones starting to take stock of Obama's truthfulness more than conservatives are here.
Good points, db. Obviously, Obama is lying because he's a racist, America-hating, Marxist, terrorist sympathizer, who took bribes to influence who will become the next Senator from Illinois. Sorry I didn't see that earlier.
Every time a Repub wins the Dems smear the majority of the American voting public. The fact of the matter is the less that our society understands economics, and the less informed they are about issues, including our history, bad and good, and our Constitution, the MORE likely it is they will vote Dem. The 25% that hate on BOTH sides try to control the middle. Obama won this time. The more illiterate the middle becomes, the more it will benefit the Dems in the long run. Why? because the Dems must have the paople beholden to big government to exist. A simple example, if they wanted the economic conditions to improve, they would reduce corporate taxes (the highest in the world) and immediately people would begin to reinvest. The problem is the Dems have to give up CONTROL to do so. That won't happen.
"Seems to me y'all should be the ones starting to take stock of Obama's truthfulness more than conservatives are here." Nah, he'll p.o. the loony right and left, but for those firmly in the center, we realize he's pragmatic not dogmatic, and will govern accordingly. Keep splicing all of his and his advisors minor comments, though.
"A simple example, if they wanted the economic conditions to improve, they would reduce corporate taxes (the highest in the world) and immediately people would begin to reinvest." Really? Aren't you paying attnetion? Corporate taxes ARE being reduced. Tell me when all that investment flocks in. Your camp also beleived lower personal taxes would lead to high GDP growth, you left out that it would all be done on debt and deficit spending.
http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1865315,00.html
"Nah, he'll p.o. the loony right and left, but for those firmly in the center, we realize he's pragmatic not dogmatic, and will govern accordingly." So in other words, it was hunky-dory to lie to the left about how he would govern as he lied to the center about the true nature of his associations with Wright and Ayers - he's just pragmatic. Gotcha.
How'd he lie to the left? what lies about associations, db? You are stretching REAL thin here. OMG, Ayers said he was a family friend, like thousands of iothers in Chicago!?!?!?!? Clearly Obama's gonna make him SecofSt, oh wait, nevermind. Keep up the ODS, its humorous.
You can't reduce corporate taxes, half of the corporations have moved off shore to avoid taxes all together. Why is there a foreign tax credit? I guess it is a back door method of supporting foreign governments socialized medicine, socialized auto industries, etc, etc.
Interesting that no one disputes the thory I porosed on the voting intelligence on teh American voter. We can argue economics, but how about our overall ability to think? Lack of an informed and wise, intelligent electorate leads to a reduction in freedom, economic and otherwise.
Well, sleepy since your theory is based on the the idea that "The Dems did it", its not really worth debating is it?
"Every time a Repub wins the Dems smear the majority of the American voting public. ...---}}} There you go. Sleepy trots out the age-old Republican toady last line of defense: "they did it first." Just so's I understand, sleepy - you're saying that smearing the majority of Americans is justified because someone else did it first? Ok. Let's extend this a bit? Would you also justify, say, blacks lynching whites because whites "did it first?"
lol! Sorry, RG.
Wow! You underestimated the actual numbers, sleepy. A full 3/4 of the American public are stupid, corrupt, or lazy - not just 1/2 as you claimed. --snip-- A new Los Angeles Times/Bloomberg poll shows that 74% of respondents have positive feelings about Obama’s presidential victory, 79% approve of the way he’s handling his transition, and 59% say they have a good idea of where Obama wants to lead the country. --snip--
I dislike these blatant inaccuracies. A full 3/4? 74% = 37/50.
Actually, Mark - I was referring to the 79% number. A full 3/4, and then some.
If you can, forgive me or have pity, because I an stupid, corrupt, and lazy
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Some people just don't like Obama so ANYTHING bad that might be true will be jumped on by them. This situtation seems like it will go nowhere. Best to wait until something concrete is found before you jump to conclusions.
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I walk on water when I go ice fishing.
Sweetness & Light commenting on this same NYTimes article: "This is simply cloud cuckoo land. We are honestly supposed to believe that some vague call to his ever so corrupt mentor, Emil Jones (who was also bidding for the Senate seat), set off the chain of events that led to Blagojevich’s downfall? That an ethics bill that passed in the Illinois Senate 55 to 0, would not have passed otherwise? And that the passing of this bill somehow made Mr. Blagojevich do things he would not have otherwise done? We are supposed to believe that Mr. Blagojevich would not have been trying to get campaign contributions otherwise? And that he would he not have still tried to sell Mr. Obama’s Senate seat to the highest bidder? And note this revisionism: "When he ran for the United States Senate in 2004, he aggressively courted Mr. Jones, a sewer inspector turned legislator who had clawed his way up through ward politics and was viewed as something of a kingmaker in the Illinois Democratic Party. "This completely turns reality on its head. As we have previously chronicled, Mr. Jones created Barack Obama. He made Obama a US Senator, and he has not be shy about bragging about it. Mr. Obama would be exactly no where without Emil Jones. And yet The Times pretends that Obama had to “court” him in 2004. This is absolutely laughable, even for the New York Times. But obviously there is no fantasy too big or too ridiculous to spin out in order to protect their Anointed One. "
Not me b.atkinson. It is entirely possible Obama had something to do with this. Perhaps he rebuked Blagojevich when he asked for favors before naming a new senator and then had nothing more to do with it. We don't know all the facts yet. I, for one will wait until I read more about this before I jump to conclusions. I have an open mind. You, on the other hand do not when it comes to anyone to the left of you.
Not me b.atkinson. It is entirely possible Obama had something to do with this. Perhaps he rebuked Blagojevich when he asked for favors before naming a new senator and then had nothing more to do with it. We don't know all the facts yet. I, for one will wait until I read more about this before I jump to conclusions. I have an open mind. You, on the other hand do not when it comes to anyone to the left of you.
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Will Bunch, a senior writer at the Philadelphia Daily News, blogs about his obsessions, including national and local politics and world affairs, the media, pop music, the Philadelphia Phillies, soccer and other sports, not necessarily in that order.
Will Bunch, a senior writer at the Philadelphia Daily News, blogs about his obsessions, including national and local politics and world affairs, the media, pop music, the Philadelphia Phillies, soccer and other sports, not necessarily in that order.
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